1 00:00:02,000 --> 00:00:04,600 Every day, we're bombarded with conflicting information 2 00:00:04,600 --> 00:00:06,280 about our favourite foods. 3 00:00:09,960 --> 00:00:13,480 One minute we're told something's good for us. The next, it's not. 4 00:00:13,480 --> 00:00:16,520 And we're left feeling guilty about what we're eating. 5 00:00:19,800 --> 00:00:22,280 So we've been wading through the confusion 6 00:00:22,280 --> 00:00:24,840 to separate the scare stories from the truth 7 00:00:24,840 --> 00:00:27,640 so that you can choose your food with confidence. 8 00:00:32,240 --> 00:00:35,280 Hello, and welcome to the programme that's here to stop us 9 00:00:35,280 --> 00:00:37,880 being hoodwinked by the headlines when it comes to our food. 10 00:00:37,880 --> 00:00:40,640 "Headlines" is the word, because I read the papers every day 11 00:00:40,640 --> 00:00:42,240 and I have to say, I am confused, 12 00:00:42,240 --> 00:00:44,360 because if you swallow everything you read 13 00:00:44,360 --> 00:00:45,960 about what is or isn't good for us - 14 00:00:45,960 --> 00:00:49,400 well, there wouldn't be much left you'd feel confident about eating. 15 00:00:49,400 --> 00:00:52,640 If your head's spinning trying to figure out which advice is correct 16 00:00:52,640 --> 00:00:54,360 and what you should be eating, 17 00:00:54,360 --> 00:00:57,120 we'll be bringing some much-needed clarity to the table 18 00:00:57,120 --> 00:01:00,040 as we discover how much of what we thought we knew 19 00:01:00,040 --> 00:01:02,240 turns out to be wrong. 20 00:01:02,240 --> 00:01:04,760 Coming up on the programme today - 21 00:01:04,760 --> 00:01:07,280 we have reassuring news about red meat, 22 00:01:07,280 --> 00:01:09,440 after particularly scary reports 23 00:01:09,440 --> 00:01:11,960 threatened to butcher businesses like this one. 24 00:01:11,960 --> 00:01:14,000 It was all a bit devastating, really. 25 00:01:14,000 --> 00:01:16,000 You know, as the papers got hold of it, 26 00:01:16,000 --> 00:01:18,960 and then, of course, it was broadcast on the news everywhere. 27 00:01:18,960 --> 00:01:23,360 And at first, you know, people are scared witless, really. 28 00:01:24,480 --> 00:01:27,280 For decades we were told fat caused heart disease, 29 00:01:27,280 --> 00:01:30,560 but as reports suggest, some old-fashioned fats 30 00:01:30,560 --> 00:01:32,520 are back in favour. 31 00:01:32,520 --> 00:01:34,640 You really get the flavour of the dripping. 32 00:01:34,640 --> 00:01:36,760 It really goes a long way, doesn't it? 33 00:01:36,760 --> 00:01:38,560 It's absolutely marvellous. 34 00:01:38,560 --> 00:01:41,040 And which bread is best - white or brown? 35 00:01:41,040 --> 00:01:44,280 Why an old favourite may not be so bad as we're often told. 36 00:01:50,480 --> 00:01:52,520 Now, if you're a committed carnivore like me, 37 00:01:52,520 --> 00:01:54,800 you'll have been horrified by the news late last year 38 00:01:54,800 --> 00:01:56,960 that eating too much processed red meat 39 00:01:56,960 --> 00:01:59,120 like sausages or bacon can cause cancer. 40 00:01:59,120 --> 00:02:01,960 Bad news for me. I have to admit, I still love a good fry-up. 41 00:02:01,960 --> 00:02:03,920 Not every day, though. I couldn't do that. 42 00:02:03,920 --> 00:02:07,600 Look at some of these headlines - Killer In The Kitchen, Banger Out Of Order. 43 00:02:07,600 --> 00:02:10,520 - They're certainly not sitting on the fence with this, are they? - No. 44 00:02:10,520 --> 00:02:12,640 - What about you? Do you still eat meat? - I do indeed. 45 00:02:12,640 --> 00:02:14,840 My wife's vegetarian, but I'm not going to lie - 46 00:02:14,840 --> 00:02:17,600 it was going to take more than these headlines to separate me 47 00:02:17,600 --> 00:02:20,200 from a bacon butty, or at least until I knew for sure 48 00:02:20,200 --> 00:02:22,480 what the risk is. So I set off to find out. 49 00:02:24,200 --> 00:02:26,400 We're a nation that loves our red meat - 50 00:02:26,400 --> 00:02:29,760 so much, in fact, that on average those of us who eat it 51 00:02:29,760 --> 00:02:33,160 get through the equivalent of three steaks every week. 52 00:02:33,160 --> 00:02:36,920 But last October, there were some particularly worrying headlines 53 00:02:36,920 --> 00:02:39,240 linking red meat and processed meat 54 00:02:39,240 --> 00:02:42,160 like bacon, ham and sausages with cancer. 55 00:02:42,160 --> 00:02:43,640 My husband says to me, 56 00:02:43,640 --> 00:02:47,440 "See? I told you we shouldn't eat bacon every day." 57 00:02:47,440 --> 00:02:51,400 And then you turn around and think, "Well, they're the experts." 58 00:02:51,400 --> 00:02:53,200 The report that sparked the headlines 59 00:02:53,200 --> 00:02:54,880 from the World Health Organization 60 00:02:54,880 --> 00:02:58,640 said processed meat in particular is a serious risk to our health. 61 00:02:58,640 --> 00:03:02,160 Each additional daily serving of processed red meat, 62 00:03:02,160 --> 00:03:05,400 the equivalent of one hot dog or two rashers of bacon, 63 00:03:05,400 --> 00:03:07,840 raises the chances of dying by a fifth. 64 00:03:10,080 --> 00:03:12,160 In the two weeks after the news broke, 65 00:03:12,160 --> 00:03:15,000 British supermarkets saw sales of sausages and bacon 66 00:03:15,000 --> 00:03:17,480 plummet by £3 million. 67 00:03:17,480 --> 00:03:20,440 And butchers like this one in Twickenham saw their sales 68 00:03:20,440 --> 00:03:23,200 of red meat drop by 10% overnight. 69 00:03:23,200 --> 00:03:25,880 - How are you? - I'm very well, mate, yeah. Yourself? 70 00:03:25,880 --> 00:03:27,480 Yeah, not too bad. 71 00:03:27,480 --> 00:03:29,920 Those headlines couldn't have come at a worse time 72 00:03:29,920 --> 00:03:32,960 for Lou and his team, as they were preparing for a special event 73 00:03:32,960 --> 00:03:36,600 that was supposed to supersize sausage sales - not slaughter them. 74 00:03:36,600 --> 00:03:39,160 It was Great British Sausage Week. 75 00:03:39,160 --> 00:03:41,840 We were all geared up for a massive campaign 76 00:03:41,840 --> 00:03:43,800 on sausages that weekend. 77 00:03:43,800 --> 00:03:46,400 We'd got all sorts of brochures, posters. 78 00:03:46,400 --> 00:03:49,400 We were going to do a big barbecue out the front of the shop. 79 00:03:49,400 --> 00:03:51,640 So it was all a bit devastating, really. 80 00:03:51,640 --> 00:03:54,400 You know, as the papers got hold of it, and then, of course, 81 00:03:54,400 --> 00:03:56,600 it was broadcast on the news everywhere. 82 00:03:56,600 --> 00:04:01,080 And at first, you know, people are scared witless, really. 83 00:04:01,080 --> 00:04:03,120 We have our own pig farm as well, 84 00:04:03,120 --> 00:04:08,200 - so we run about 150 to 200 pigs at a time. - Right. 85 00:04:08,200 --> 00:04:11,760 So if the supply chain here sort of dries up, 86 00:04:11,760 --> 00:04:13,560 we've got a ruined business. 87 00:04:14,720 --> 00:04:18,040 I visited the shop a few weeks after those first headlines, 88 00:04:18,040 --> 00:04:20,720 and I wanted to see if, now the dust had settled, 89 00:04:20,720 --> 00:04:23,680 Lou's loyal customers had been put off red meat for good. 90 00:04:23,680 --> 00:04:26,400 So do you mind if I get stuck in and talk to a few of your customers 91 00:04:26,400 --> 00:04:29,160 about the concerns they have about red and processed meat? 92 00:04:29,160 --> 00:04:31,640 - No, no problem at all. - Brilliant. - Let's get you kitted up! 93 00:04:31,640 --> 00:04:34,280 Fantastic. Put on the famous red-and-white apron, huh? 94 00:04:34,280 --> 00:04:36,840 Sales of sausages and bacon nationally, 95 00:04:36,840 --> 00:04:38,560 already slowly declining, 96 00:04:38,560 --> 00:04:41,440 dropped rapidly in the months following the new report. 97 00:04:41,440 --> 00:04:43,680 But there's little sign of that here. 98 00:04:43,680 --> 00:04:46,440 There were recent health scares - the World Health Organization 99 00:04:46,440 --> 00:04:48,600 said that processed meat was very bad for you, 100 00:04:48,600 --> 00:04:51,960 increased risk of cancer - what do you think about that? 101 00:04:53,160 --> 00:04:55,920 There's always a scare, isn't there, about something or other? 102 00:04:55,920 --> 00:04:57,680 I would imagine that it's complete tosh. 103 00:04:57,680 --> 00:04:59,160 THEY LAUGH 104 00:04:59,160 --> 00:05:00,760 No. You only live here once. 105 00:05:00,760 --> 00:05:03,680 Enjoy your meat while you're here, while you can still eat it 106 00:05:03,680 --> 00:05:05,960 and while your teeth are still in your mouth. 107 00:05:05,960 --> 00:05:08,880 So enjoy it. Forget all the other scares. Move on. 108 00:05:08,880 --> 00:05:10,160 Where's my ham? 109 00:05:10,160 --> 00:05:12,200 - So you're not worried? - No, I'm not. 110 00:05:12,200 --> 00:05:15,560 If you buy good quality from a reputable source, 111 00:05:15,560 --> 00:05:18,760 then I think you're fine. You're absolutely fine. 112 00:05:20,200 --> 00:05:23,160 In fact, all the customers I met had taken the news 113 00:05:23,160 --> 00:05:24,680 with a hefty pinch of salt. 114 00:05:25,800 --> 00:05:27,240 It's good news for Lou - 115 00:05:27,240 --> 00:05:29,960 in his shop, at least, sales are back to normal. 116 00:05:29,960 --> 00:05:33,120 It certainly has recovered right back to where we were before, 117 00:05:33,120 --> 00:05:37,040 so it's not killed it dead in the water. Definitely not. 118 00:05:37,040 --> 00:05:39,680 After speaking to a few people this morning, it seems that 119 00:05:39,680 --> 00:05:42,480 although they may have been a little bit concerned initially, 120 00:05:42,480 --> 00:05:44,360 after a fairly short period of time, 121 00:05:44,360 --> 00:05:46,400 they've got back into their old routines, 122 00:05:46,400 --> 00:05:48,720 and what they are doing is putting their trust 123 00:05:48,720 --> 00:05:52,880 in the great British butcher to provide them with good-quality meat. 124 00:05:52,880 --> 00:05:55,000 So we might not have fallen out of love 125 00:05:55,000 --> 00:05:56,960 with red or processed meat entirely, 126 00:05:56,960 --> 00:05:59,200 but those headlines WERE pretty scary. 127 00:05:59,200 --> 00:06:02,800 The World Health Organization said that 50g of processed meat 128 00:06:02,800 --> 00:06:05,480 every day - that's about two rashers of bacon - 129 00:06:05,480 --> 00:06:09,240 could increase the risk of some types of cancer by up to 18%. 130 00:06:09,240 --> 00:06:13,000 And as someone who's particularly partial to a good sausage sandwich, 131 00:06:13,000 --> 00:06:14,680 that had worried me. 132 00:06:14,680 --> 00:06:18,000 So, to make sense of it all, I've come to King's College in London 133 00:06:18,000 --> 00:06:19,760 to ask Prof David Phillips 134 00:06:19,760 --> 00:06:22,080 whether I should bin the bangers for good. 135 00:06:22,080 --> 00:06:26,480 So, David, what is it in red meat that's dangerous to us? 136 00:06:26,480 --> 00:06:28,400 Well, first of all, we have to distinguish 137 00:06:28,400 --> 00:06:30,360 between red meat and processed meat. 138 00:06:30,360 --> 00:06:32,240 So red meat, over here, 139 00:06:32,240 --> 00:06:36,520 is fresh meat - be it lamb, pork or beef. 140 00:06:36,520 --> 00:06:40,680 And then you have processed meat, which is food of similar origin 141 00:06:40,680 --> 00:06:42,880 - but which has been preserved in some way. - OK. 142 00:06:42,880 --> 00:06:46,440 So there's the sausages, bacon, ham, salami, pepperoni. 143 00:06:46,440 --> 00:06:49,600 It's had preservatives added to it in order to prolong its life, 144 00:06:49,600 --> 00:06:51,400 and that also altered its flavour, 145 00:06:51,400 --> 00:06:53,640 and these are the things that we're familiar with. 146 00:06:53,640 --> 00:06:55,120 OK, so we've got mince here. 147 00:06:55,120 --> 00:06:58,080 Should mince be on the plate with the processed meats? 148 00:06:58,080 --> 00:07:00,120 No, mince is still fresh meat. 149 00:07:00,120 --> 00:07:02,000 It hasn't been preserved in any way. 150 00:07:02,000 --> 00:07:04,640 It's been processed in the sense it's been mashed up, 151 00:07:04,640 --> 00:07:07,640 but no preservatives have been added to it. 152 00:07:07,640 --> 00:07:09,720 But the mince doesn't get off scot-free. 153 00:07:09,720 --> 00:07:12,800 The World Health Organization's report said that processed meat 154 00:07:12,800 --> 00:07:15,680 like bacon, packed ham and sausages carry the highest risk, 155 00:07:15,680 --> 00:07:18,800 thanks to the carcinogens released when the meat is cured, 156 00:07:18,800 --> 00:07:20,400 smoked or processed. 157 00:07:20,400 --> 00:07:24,680 But the report also said that eating too much unprocessed red meat 158 00:07:24,680 --> 00:07:26,120 carries a risk too. 159 00:07:27,160 --> 00:07:30,880 But what is it about all of these meats that are dangerous to us? 160 00:07:30,880 --> 00:07:33,560 Well, in the case of the red meat first, 161 00:07:33,560 --> 00:07:38,280 this contains high amounts of a substance called haem. 162 00:07:38,280 --> 00:07:41,480 Haem contains iron, and we need iron in our diets, 163 00:07:41,480 --> 00:07:44,360 but also, haem can be broken down in the gut 164 00:07:44,360 --> 00:07:47,400 to harmful chemicals, and we think it's possible 165 00:07:47,400 --> 00:07:50,840 that some of these chemicals might be able to trigger cancer. 166 00:07:50,840 --> 00:07:53,320 OK, and haem - that's blood, isn't it? 167 00:07:53,320 --> 00:07:55,920 Haem is in blood. That's what makes blood red. 168 00:07:55,920 --> 00:07:58,280 It carries the oxygen around our body. 169 00:07:58,280 --> 00:08:00,040 Well, that sounds like a good thing. 170 00:08:00,040 --> 00:08:02,280 So what is it about this that's dangerous for us? 171 00:08:02,280 --> 00:08:06,480 Well, if we eat a lot of haem in our diet, 172 00:08:06,480 --> 00:08:08,480 then that gets into the gut 173 00:08:08,480 --> 00:08:11,840 and there it can get broken down into harmful chemicals 174 00:08:11,840 --> 00:08:14,720 which could cause bowel cancer. 175 00:08:14,720 --> 00:08:17,760 But the report also made clear that all processed meat, 176 00:08:17,760 --> 00:08:20,920 whether it's red or white, carries an additional risk. 177 00:08:22,280 --> 00:08:24,560 The chemicals that are generated 178 00:08:24,560 --> 00:08:28,680 during the processing of the meat or in the cooking of the meat 179 00:08:28,680 --> 00:08:32,240 can additionally cause damage to the cells in our bowels, 180 00:08:32,240 --> 00:08:35,600 and that makes an additional risk of cancer. 181 00:08:35,600 --> 00:08:39,080 As a result, the official NHS advice is not to eat more 182 00:08:39,080 --> 00:08:42,240 than 70g of either processed or red meat a day. 183 00:08:42,240 --> 00:08:44,960 That's about the same as two to three rashers of bacon 184 00:08:44,960 --> 00:08:47,040 or two small slices of roast beef. 185 00:08:47,040 --> 00:08:50,240 So should we be concerned about eating red and processed meat? 186 00:08:50,240 --> 00:08:52,160 Not if we don't eat too much of it. 187 00:08:52,160 --> 00:08:55,520 But it's fair to say that of the many cases of cancer 188 00:08:55,520 --> 00:08:59,000 that occur in the UK, a small proportion of them 189 00:08:59,000 --> 00:09:02,000 will be due to eating too much red meat. 190 00:09:02,000 --> 00:09:04,720 A very small proportion, in fact. 191 00:09:04,720 --> 00:09:06,440 In a group of 1,000 people 192 00:09:06,440 --> 00:09:09,080 who ate a small amount of processed meat each week, 193 00:09:09,080 --> 00:09:10,920 56 would develop bowel cancer. 194 00:09:10,920 --> 00:09:14,400 But in a group of 1,000 people who ate a lot of processed meat, 195 00:09:14,400 --> 00:09:17,840 only ten more, 66, would develop it. 196 00:09:17,840 --> 00:09:21,000 So while statistically there IS a higher risk, it's not as high 197 00:09:21,000 --> 00:09:23,840 as some of those headlines might have led you to believe. 198 00:09:23,840 --> 00:09:27,640 In fact, it's thought that just 34,000 cases of bowel cancer 199 00:09:27,640 --> 00:09:30,760 worldwide are caused by eating processed meat. 200 00:09:30,760 --> 00:09:33,360 So no-one's saying that processed meat or red meat 201 00:09:33,360 --> 00:09:35,080 will definitely give you cancer - 202 00:09:35,080 --> 00:09:38,040 it's just that your risk of developing it is slightly higher 203 00:09:38,040 --> 00:09:39,840 if you eat too much. 204 00:09:39,840 --> 00:09:41,640 So should I feel worried or guilty 205 00:09:41,640 --> 00:09:44,080 the next time I want to tuck into a bacon sandwich? 206 00:09:44,080 --> 00:09:46,520 Absolutely not. I think you should think about 207 00:09:46,520 --> 00:09:49,080 how many times you are tucking into a bacon sandwich, 208 00:09:49,080 --> 00:09:51,440 rather than whether you tuck into one or not. 209 00:09:51,440 --> 00:09:53,960 So despite those terrifying headlines, 210 00:09:53,960 --> 00:09:57,040 there's no need to take red meat off the menu entirely, 211 00:09:57,040 --> 00:10:00,560 not least because, in moderation, it can be really good for us. 212 00:10:00,560 --> 00:10:04,040 And nutritionist Priya Tew can explain why. 213 00:10:04,040 --> 00:10:06,560 So we've got lots of different cuts of red meat here, 214 00:10:06,560 --> 00:10:08,040 which all look very appetising, 215 00:10:08,040 --> 00:10:11,040 but apart from taste and flavour, do they offer us anything? 216 00:10:11,040 --> 00:10:14,240 Absolutely. It's a brilliant source of protein, 217 00:10:14,240 --> 00:10:17,000 it's leaner in fat than most people would think, 218 00:10:17,000 --> 00:10:21,240 it contains B vitamins, some vitamin D and selenium 219 00:10:21,240 --> 00:10:23,120 as well as iron and zinc. 220 00:10:23,120 --> 00:10:26,440 And that iron in particular is an especially useful nutrient 221 00:10:26,440 --> 00:10:28,000 for many of us. 222 00:10:28,000 --> 00:10:30,640 We know that, worldwide, 223 00:10:30,640 --> 00:10:34,360 population figures are that 30% of people are anaemic, 224 00:10:34,360 --> 00:10:36,400 so they have low levels of iron. 225 00:10:36,400 --> 00:10:39,880 When we look at the UK population, it's not necessarily that 226 00:10:39,880 --> 00:10:42,520 everybody's going to have a problem with their iron, 227 00:10:42,520 --> 00:10:45,680 but teenage girls, for example, pregnant women 228 00:10:45,680 --> 00:10:49,680 are people who are more susceptible to having low iron levels, 229 00:10:49,680 --> 00:10:51,960 so we definitely want to be encouraging them 230 00:10:51,960 --> 00:10:53,760 to be eating red meat regularly. 231 00:10:53,760 --> 00:10:56,400 You're saying that actually these can offer 232 00:10:56,400 --> 00:10:58,960 a lot of nutritional value and goodness as well? 233 00:10:58,960 --> 00:11:03,280 Yes, I am. So if you were having 70g of red meat a day, 234 00:11:03,280 --> 00:11:04,920 that's perfectly safe. 235 00:11:04,920 --> 00:11:08,360 So that could be equivalent to you having your 4oz steak 236 00:11:08,360 --> 00:11:10,760 a couple of times a week, for example, 237 00:11:10,760 --> 00:11:14,160 making sure you are having some meat-free days as well. 238 00:11:14,160 --> 00:11:16,480 So there is nothing wrong with having red meat 239 00:11:16,480 --> 00:11:18,840 and even processed meat a few times a week 240 00:11:18,840 --> 00:11:20,920 as part of a healthy, balanced diet. 241 00:11:20,920 --> 00:11:23,080 That's music to my ears. And on that note, 242 00:11:23,080 --> 00:11:26,320 I'm off to tuck into a juicy quarter-pounder, guilt free. 243 00:11:28,480 --> 00:11:31,760 If the news about the link between processed red meat and cancer 244 00:11:31,760 --> 00:11:34,560 has prompted you to cut back on the amount of red meat you eat, 245 00:11:34,560 --> 00:11:38,400 visit bbc.co.uk/food for quick and easy recipes 246 00:11:38,400 --> 00:11:41,960 that swap processed and red meat for healthier alternatives. 247 00:11:46,720 --> 00:11:48,160 It was a huge relief to me to find 248 00:11:48,160 --> 00:11:51,640 that I can still enjoy the odd bacon butty as long as it's not every day. 249 00:11:51,640 --> 00:11:54,200 I have to admit, I took the report really seriously 250 00:11:54,200 --> 00:11:56,240 because we've got cancer in our family, 251 00:11:56,240 --> 00:11:58,240 though I have not cut back completely. 252 00:11:58,240 --> 00:12:01,080 I still have a little bit of it, because I think in the end, 253 00:12:01,080 --> 00:12:03,080 people go for moderation, don't they? 254 00:12:03,080 --> 00:12:06,640 But it's not just the case that health messages can change 255 00:12:06,640 --> 00:12:09,520 to make something that one day is supposedly good for you 256 00:12:09,520 --> 00:12:11,440 turn out to be bad for you the next. 257 00:12:11,440 --> 00:12:13,800 It happens, actually, the other way around. 258 00:12:13,800 --> 00:12:17,320 Now, take saturated fats - found, of course, in things like 259 00:12:17,320 --> 00:12:19,720 full-fat milk, butter and lard. 260 00:12:19,720 --> 00:12:22,880 For years we were told that they raised our cholesterol levels 261 00:12:22,880 --> 00:12:24,720 and were linked to heart disease. 262 00:12:24,720 --> 00:12:29,000 The link now between saturated fat and heart disease is being debunked. 263 00:12:29,000 --> 00:12:31,400 So have a look at this headline, for example - 264 00:12:31,400 --> 00:12:33,200 Eating Fat Is Good For You. 265 00:12:33,200 --> 00:12:36,360 After 40 years of warnings, the doctors say it's now healthy. 266 00:12:36,360 --> 00:12:38,560 - That caught a lot of us by surprise, didn't it? - Yeah. 267 00:12:38,560 --> 00:12:40,720 Because for years we were thinking about the fat. 268 00:12:40,720 --> 00:12:43,040 The question is, to know which fats are fine 269 00:12:43,040 --> 00:12:44,720 to go back on the menu. 270 00:12:48,000 --> 00:12:51,520 Once upon a time, Britain's dinner tables groaned under the weight 271 00:12:51,520 --> 00:12:55,200 of meals that we'd now consider terrifyingly unhealthy. 272 00:12:55,200 --> 00:12:58,360 But in the '80s and '90s, a healthy eating revolution 273 00:12:58,360 --> 00:13:01,960 swept the nation, turning lots of us into calorie obsessives 274 00:13:01,960 --> 00:13:05,360 fearful of one thing more than anything else - fat. 275 00:13:05,360 --> 00:13:07,280 And a host of new products appeared 276 00:13:07,280 --> 00:13:10,280 with the promise that they were better for us. 277 00:13:10,280 --> 00:13:12,640 # No artificial ingredients 278 00:13:12,640 --> 00:13:14,080 # Nothing artificial 279 00:13:14,080 --> 00:13:17,360 # That's the best feeling from Blue Band Margarine 280 00:13:17,360 --> 00:13:19,040 # It couldn't be better. # 281 00:13:20,640 --> 00:13:22,240 St Ivel Gold. 282 00:13:22,240 --> 00:13:23,960 Half the fat of any margarine. 283 00:13:25,120 --> 00:13:26,920 And it tastes... 284 00:13:26,920 --> 00:13:28,400 smashing. 285 00:13:30,720 --> 00:13:34,520 We swapped butter for margarine, lard for vegetable oil, 286 00:13:34,520 --> 00:13:36,520 full-cream milk for skimmed. 287 00:13:36,520 --> 00:13:38,760 We'd all got the message that saturated fat, 288 00:13:38,760 --> 00:13:41,600 found in animal fats like lard and butter, 289 00:13:41,600 --> 00:13:44,840 was clogging our arteries and putting a strain on our hearts. 290 00:13:44,840 --> 00:13:48,960 So instead, we turned to products that were low in saturated fats 291 00:13:48,960 --> 00:13:52,720 that we were advised were much less likely to cause heart disease. 292 00:13:52,720 --> 00:13:55,640 And that way of thinking stuck with us for decades 293 00:13:55,640 --> 00:13:58,400 until a clutch of recent reports seemed to suggest 294 00:13:58,400 --> 00:14:00,040 that we should forget all of that. 295 00:14:02,240 --> 00:14:04,920 An international study has discovered little evidence 296 00:14:04,920 --> 00:14:06,840 that polyunsaturated fats, 297 00:14:06,840 --> 00:14:09,080 which are found in olive oil, nuts and fish, 298 00:14:09,080 --> 00:14:12,880 offer better protection from heart disease than saturated fats. 299 00:14:12,880 --> 00:14:16,000 Suddenly, it seemed the fats that for years we'd been told 300 00:14:16,000 --> 00:14:18,440 were bad for our hearts might not be. 301 00:14:18,440 --> 00:14:21,200 And the ones we'd replaced them with weren't necessarily 302 00:14:21,200 --> 00:14:23,000 any better for us after all. 303 00:14:23,000 --> 00:14:24,640 So, what to believe? 304 00:14:25,840 --> 00:14:28,280 Some people have said that you can't eat butter, 305 00:14:28,280 --> 00:14:29,720 that's got a lot of fat in it, 306 00:14:29,720 --> 00:14:31,840 and then other people say you can eat butter. 307 00:14:31,840 --> 00:14:34,160 I know that there are good fats and there are bad fats, 308 00:14:34,160 --> 00:14:36,080 but I couldn't tell you the difference. 309 00:14:36,080 --> 00:14:38,520 Your good fats are things like 310 00:14:38,520 --> 00:14:42,080 - natural olive oils, that sort of thing. - Omega. - Yeah. 311 00:14:42,080 --> 00:14:44,240 Your bad fats are the animal fats. 312 00:14:44,240 --> 00:14:46,400 I must admit, I really do like butter, 313 00:14:46,400 --> 00:14:48,160 so I'm actually going onto butter 314 00:14:48,160 --> 00:14:51,760 away from so-called healthy margarines. 315 00:14:54,800 --> 00:14:57,000 I have to admit that the idea that butter 316 00:14:57,000 --> 00:14:59,600 needn't be one of my guilty pleasures is great. 317 00:14:59,600 --> 00:15:02,800 But what has changed? I've come to meet Prof Bruce Griffin 318 00:15:02,800 --> 00:15:04,600 at the University of Surrey 319 00:15:04,600 --> 00:15:07,480 to try to get a clear answer on this once and for all. 320 00:15:08,920 --> 00:15:12,120 Saturated fats, processed fats - we all get very confused, 321 00:15:12,120 --> 00:15:14,400 so just explain the difference between them. 322 00:15:14,400 --> 00:15:17,080 The main two categories of fats are saturated fat 323 00:15:17,080 --> 00:15:18,720 and polyunsaturated fats. 324 00:15:18,720 --> 00:15:22,240 Now, classically, saturated fats come from animal sources, 325 00:15:22,240 --> 00:15:25,000 and polyunsaturates come from plant sources. 326 00:15:25,000 --> 00:15:29,400 Classically, butter contains about 50% saturated fat, 327 00:15:29,400 --> 00:15:34,000 and this spread would contain large amounts of polyunsaturated fats. 328 00:15:34,000 --> 00:15:37,480 Saturated fats tends to be solid at room temperature, 329 00:15:37,480 --> 00:15:39,760 like the fat we have here. 330 00:15:39,760 --> 00:15:43,000 And polyunsaturated fats tend to be liquids at room temperature. 331 00:15:45,200 --> 00:15:48,560 It's those solid saturated fats that had long been linked 332 00:15:48,560 --> 00:15:51,560 to heart disease, which is why we were all encouraged 333 00:15:51,560 --> 00:15:55,760 to reduce the amount of animal fats we ate, like butter and lard. 334 00:15:55,760 --> 00:15:58,080 Meanwhile, polyunsaturated fats 335 00:15:58,080 --> 00:16:00,880 were thought to actually protect the heart. 336 00:16:00,880 --> 00:16:03,560 But the reports published in 2015 337 00:16:03,560 --> 00:16:05,840 poured cold water on all of that. 338 00:16:05,840 --> 00:16:09,400 They compared dozens of studies that took place over decades 339 00:16:09,400 --> 00:16:12,880 and concluded there was simply no proof that saturated fat 340 00:16:12,880 --> 00:16:17,680 caused heart disease, or indeed that polyunsaturated fats didn't. 341 00:16:17,680 --> 00:16:21,400 There have been some very large studies called meta-analyses, 342 00:16:21,400 --> 00:16:24,280 which have tried to demonstrate a relationship 343 00:16:24,280 --> 00:16:27,640 between the intake of saturated fat and cardiovascular disease, 344 00:16:27,640 --> 00:16:29,280 and they haven't been able to do it. 345 00:16:29,280 --> 00:16:31,880 They've shown no relationship between the intake 346 00:16:31,880 --> 00:16:34,880 of saturated fat and cardiovascular disease. 347 00:16:34,880 --> 00:16:37,240 And this has led to people believing 348 00:16:37,240 --> 00:16:40,360 that our recommendations are maybe incorrect 349 00:16:40,360 --> 00:16:43,720 that we should be reducing our intake of saturated fat. 350 00:16:43,720 --> 00:16:46,800 My immediate reaction on reading the latest headlines, 351 00:16:46,800 --> 00:16:48,520 and maybe your thoughts as well, 352 00:16:48,520 --> 00:16:51,360 was that if they were right, perhaps it was time to start 353 00:16:51,360 --> 00:16:53,600 rethinking our relationship with fats. 354 00:16:53,600 --> 00:16:56,640 Now, for years, I've used low-fat spreads and oils 355 00:16:56,640 --> 00:16:59,120 in place of the butter I'd much rather be using, 356 00:16:59,120 --> 00:17:02,640 all because I'd been worried about that link with heart disease. 357 00:17:02,640 --> 00:17:05,840 And maybe the apparent change in the advice explains 358 00:17:05,840 --> 00:17:09,720 why some long-forgotten fats are now coming back on the menu. 359 00:17:09,720 --> 00:17:12,800 Shaun Searley is head chef at this restaurant in London, 360 00:17:12,800 --> 00:17:16,040 where he serves my mum's good old favourite - dripping. 361 00:17:16,040 --> 00:17:19,600 For years firmly out of fashion, it's now the latest fad. 362 00:17:19,600 --> 00:17:22,760 James Martin, for example, says it's the secret to fruit cake, 363 00:17:22,760 --> 00:17:25,360 and Heston Blumenthal to roast potatoes. 364 00:17:25,360 --> 00:17:28,280 Shaun, thank you very much for letting me come into your kitchen. 365 00:17:28,280 --> 00:17:31,880 Way, way back, my mum would have had dripping and also lard. 366 00:17:31,880 --> 00:17:33,880 But maybe we could have the definition 367 00:17:33,880 --> 00:17:35,920 of the difference between lard and dripping? 368 00:17:35,920 --> 00:17:39,520 Yeah. I mean, it's simple, really - lard would be pork fat, 369 00:17:39,520 --> 00:17:41,800 and dripping would come from beef. 370 00:17:43,040 --> 00:17:46,800 But unlike my mum, Shaun's using his dripping very sparingly. 371 00:17:46,800 --> 00:17:50,000 Its potent taste means that you don't need much at all. 372 00:17:50,000 --> 00:17:53,400 And all it will do is add layer upon layer of flavour. 373 00:17:53,400 --> 00:17:55,760 You talk about the flavour being everything 374 00:17:55,760 --> 00:17:57,760 for this particular dish - do you find that 375 00:17:57,760 --> 00:18:00,560 because it is so flavoursome that you actually use less? 376 00:18:00,560 --> 00:18:04,080 Absolutely. I mean, the richness will go a lot further 377 00:18:04,080 --> 00:18:07,280 than, say, a butter, which has quite a neutral flavour. 378 00:18:07,280 --> 00:18:10,320 Especially something that you've bought, sort of a generic style. 379 00:18:10,320 --> 00:18:11,840 This beef fat is going to be... 380 00:18:11,840 --> 00:18:16,280 It's going to last you double, probably, the butter. 381 00:18:17,280 --> 00:18:20,200 Beef dripping, into the pan, your toast goes in. 382 00:18:20,200 --> 00:18:22,280 'The dripping's distinctive aroma 383 00:18:22,280 --> 00:18:24,840 'really does take me back to my youth...' 384 00:18:24,840 --> 00:18:26,280 Bit on the side. 385 00:18:26,280 --> 00:18:28,800 '..but will it taste as good as I remember?' 386 00:18:28,800 --> 00:18:30,120 Can't wait to try this. 387 00:18:31,760 --> 00:18:33,120 Mmm. 388 00:18:33,120 --> 00:18:35,440 You really get the flavour of the dripping. 389 00:18:35,440 --> 00:18:37,480 It really goes a long way, doesn't it? 390 00:18:37,480 --> 00:18:39,720 And I think when you've fried it with that sourdough, 391 00:18:39,720 --> 00:18:43,120 you get these kind of sweet, nutty flavours from the beef fat. 392 00:18:43,120 --> 00:18:45,320 It's absolutely marvellous. 393 00:18:46,720 --> 00:18:49,440 When my mum was cooking with dripping or butter, 394 00:18:49,440 --> 00:18:52,000 our national diet was very different. 395 00:18:52,000 --> 00:18:54,240 In the late '50s we ate - wait for this - 396 00:18:54,240 --> 00:18:56,920 129g of butter a day. 397 00:18:56,920 --> 00:18:59,240 That's more than half a pack each. 398 00:18:59,240 --> 00:19:02,960 But since then, encouraged by the message that saturated fats 399 00:19:02,960 --> 00:19:05,720 were especially bad, we've reduced our butter habit 400 00:19:05,720 --> 00:19:07,680 to just 40g a day. 401 00:19:07,680 --> 00:19:11,240 And we also slashed the total amount of saturated fat we ate 402 00:19:11,240 --> 00:19:15,040 from 111g a day each in 1975 403 00:19:15,040 --> 00:19:18,520 to 81g a day each in 2012. 404 00:19:18,520 --> 00:19:22,160 And that's no bad thing, because although we do need some fats 405 00:19:22,160 --> 00:19:25,640 in our diet to help absorb vital vitamins, amongst other things, 406 00:19:25,640 --> 00:19:29,000 back at the university, it turns out that what's really behind 407 00:19:29,000 --> 00:19:32,920 all those headlines isn't quite as simple as it might have appeared. 408 00:19:33,920 --> 00:19:37,080 The implication of some of these reports in the papers 409 00:19:37,080 --> 00:19:39,920 is that you can have as much saturated fat as you want 410 00:19:39,920 --> 00:19:42,720 - and it's not affecting your heart. - No, that's not true. 411 00:19:42,720 --> 00:19:45,720 These very large studies haven't necessarily come up with 412 00:19:45,720 --> 00:19:50,240 the right answer, because the relationship between saturated fat 413 00:19:50,240 --> 00:19:53,400 and cardiovascular disease is more complex 414 00:19:53,400 --> 00:19:56,080 than we have understood in the past. 415 00:19:56,080 --> 00:19:59,200 The truth is, putting together all the research 416 00:19:59,200 --> 00:20:01,080 hasn't been able to prove a link 417 00:20:01,080 --> 00:20:03,800 between saturated fats and heart disease. 418 00:20:03,800 --> 00:20:06,080 It doesn't mean for sure that there isn't one, 419 00:20:06,080 --> 00:20:09,280 or, indeed, that you can suddenly eat as much butter as you like. 420 00:20:09,280 --> 00:20:12,520 Which is why the NHS advice on this hasn't changed. 421 00:20:12,520 --> 00:20:15,600 But the new research does mean if you gave up these fats 422 00:20:15,600 --> 00:20:18,720 purely because it seemed there was a definite, proven risk 423 00:20:18,720 --> 00:20:22,280 with heart disease - well, I'm afraid that wasn't the case. 424 00:20:22,280 --> 00:20:25,720 I'd love to take some advice about keeping your heart healthy. 425 00:20:25,720 --> 00:20:28,520 What would your professional advice be there? 426 00:20:28,520 --> 00:20:30,800 Well, overall, I think what we've got to do 427 00:20:30,800 --> 00:20:35,000 is move away from focusing on single nutrients, 428 00:20:35,000 --> 00:20:38,280 like certain types of fat, and look at whole diets. 429 00:20:38,280 --> 00:20:40,720 Because it's whole diets and dietary patterns, 430 00:20:40,720 --> 00:20:43,480 changing the dietary pattern, that we know has a benefit 431 00:20:43,480 --> 00:20:45,920 of protecting us from cardiovascular disease. 432 00:20:45,920 --> 00:20:49,000 The best evidence we have is the effects of the Mediterranean diet, 433 00:20:49,000 --> 00:20:53,800 which is low in saturated fat and high in unsaturated fats. 434 00:20:53,800 --> 00:20:56,400 It's one diet that we know actually works 435 00:20:56,400 --> 00:20:58,640 in preventing cardiovascular disease. 436 00:20:58,640 --> 00:21:01,720 It's altering our overall dietary pattern that's important. 437 00:21:03,520 --> 00:21:06,840 And while it's good news that saturated fats need no longer 438 00:21:06,840 --> 00:21:09,760 be demonised as a particular cause of heart disease, 439 00:21:09,760 --> 00:21:12,800 eating too much of any kind of fat can lead to obesity, 440 00:21:12,800 --> 00:21:14,600 which does damage your heart. 441 00:21:14,600 --> 00:21:18,280 So the message is still, put simply, don't eat too much. 442 00:21:18,280 --> 00:21:22,120 For a man, the limit should be 30g of saturated fat a day, 443 00:21:22,120 --> 00:21:24,560 and for a woman, it's 20g a day. 444 00:21:26,000 --> 00:21:28,680 But at least you don't have to avoid it altogether. 445 00:21:28,680 --> 00:21:31,000 Well, seeing as I'm partial to a bit of butter, 446 00:21:31,000 --> 00:21:33,720 what should I actually be putting on my toast every day? 447 00:21:33,720 --> 00:21:36,080 Should I feel guilty about having it? 448 00:21:36,080 --> 00:21:38,800 I don't think so, as long as you're aware 449 00:21:38,800 --> 00:21:41,200 that that's providing about a quarter 450 00:21:41,200 --> 00:21:44,760 of the recommended level of intake of saturated fat in your diet, 451 00:21:44,760 --> 00:21:47,360 and you impose some control 452 00:21:47,360 --> 00:21:50,480 over the rest of the day and what you eat. 453 00:21:50,480 --> 00:21:53,560 I think common sense and eating these foods in moderation 454 00:21:53,560 --> 00:21:56,240 is very important. Not just for saturated fat intake, 455 00:21:56,240 --> 00:21:59,200 but also for the energy intake to maintain your body weight, 456 00:21:59,200 --> 00:22:02,320 - I think is critical. - So moderation is your phrase? 457 00:22:02,320 --> 00:22:03,600 Moderation, yeah. 458 00:22:05,800 --> 00:22:07,560 So, much as I really enjoyed it, 459 00:22:07,560 --> 00:22:11,000 I won't be putting dripping on the menu in my house too often. 460 00:22:15,080 --> 00:22:17,720 Still to come - how the original superfood 461 00:22:17,720 --> 00:22:19,840 was banished from our plates for 20 years 462 00:22:19,840 --> 00:22:22,600 thanks to science that simply doesn't stand up. 463 00:22:22,600 --> 00:22:24,840 In the '80s, we had all sorts of scares - 464 00:22:24,840 --> 00:22:28,120 cholesterol in eggs was bad for you. Then Edwina did her bit, 465 00:22:28,120 --> 00:22:30,760 and we saw the bottom of the market then, I guess. 466 00:22:36,720 --> 00:22:38,960 The food we eat has amazing powers 467 00:22:38,960 --> 00:22:43,000 and can help our bodies conquer all sorts of common conditions. 468 00:22:43,000 --> 00:22:47,080 Every day, GP Dr Rangan Chatterjee sees patients 469 00:22:47,080 --> 00:22:51,320 whose problems could be helped or even solved by changing their diet. 470 00:22:51,320 --> 00:22:54,880 So we asked him to share some of his secrets. 471 00:22:54,880 --> 00:22:58,440 Today, it's the digestive system - the group of organs 472 00:22:58,440 --> 00:23:02,800 that convert food into energy that fuels the entire body. 473 00:23:02,800 --> 00:23:05,880 When it comes to problems with the digestive system, 474 00:23:05,880 --> 00:23:09,160 there's nothing more important than what you eat. 475 00:23:09,160 --> 00:23:13,240 One in three of us suffers some kind of digestive discomfort, 476 00:23:13,240 --> 00:23:17,280 with the biggest complaint simply the pains we call indigestion. 477 00:23:17,280 --> 00:23:20,480 Typically, when people get indigestion, 478 00:23:20,480 --> 00:23:24,440 they get pain in their upper abdomen or behind their breastbone. 479 00:23:24,440 --> 00:23:27,400 Often a result of eating too fast or too much, 480 00:23:27,400 --> 00:23:30,720 indigestion is caused by acids that break down the food inside us, 481 00:23:30,720 --> 00:23:32,920 irritating the lining of our stomach. 482 00:23:34,080 --> 00:23:36,720 The foods that typically can cause us symptoms 483 00:23:36,720 --> 00:23:38,720 are fried, fatty foods - 484 00:23:38,720 --> 00:23:41,000 sometimes sausages, sometimes bacon - 485 00:23:41,000 --> 00:23:42,640 fatty foods such as cream. 486 00:23:42,640 --> 00:23:44,000 If you cut these out, 487 00:23:44,000 --> 00:23:47,520 often people find an improvement in their symptoms. 488 00:23:47,520 --> 00:23:50,560 Other common triggers for indigestion can be curries, 489 00:23:50,560 --> 00:23:54,240 cucumbers, citrus fruits and carbonated drinks. 490 00:23:54,240 --> 00:23:57,360 Now, you may know that if you put a penny in a glass 491 00:23:57,360 --> 00:24:01,120 and you pour cola in, it will clean it overnight, 492 00:24:01,120 --> 00:24:04,040 and that's because of the kind of acid that's in the cola. 493 00:24:04,040 --> 00:24:06,920 It's corrosive, and it's called phosphoric acid. 494 00:24:06,920 --> 00:24:09,160 And that could precipitate acid reflux 495 00:24:09,160 --> 00:24:11,280 and more indigestion symptoms. 496 00:24:11,280 --> 00:24:14,400 That's why, if you do have indigestion, I'd certainly say 497 00:24:14,400 --> 00:24:18,000 you should cut down on fizzy drinks or even eliminate them if you can. 498 00:24:18,000 --> 00:24:20,400 Instead of the fizz, reach for a tea - 499 00:24:20,400 --> 00:24:22,200 but not one made with mint. 500 00:24:22,200 --> 00:24:25,160 We may have used mint to aid digestion for generations, 501 00:24:25,160 --> 00:24:28,920 but in some cases it's been found to actually make heartburn worse. 502 00:24:28,920 --> 00:24:32,800 So you'd be better choosing one made with ginger to settle your stomach. 503 00:24:32,800 --> 00:24:35,880 Or you could reach for the so-called friendly bacteria 504 00:24:35,880 --> 00:24:39,960 found in probiotic tablets, which might help balance the stomach. 505 00:24:39,960 --> 00:24:43,760 Probiotics might also be beneficial for sufferers of another 506 00:24:43,760 --> 00:24:47,720 common digestive condition - irritable bowel syndrome. 507 00:24:47,720 --> 00:24:50,640 IBS is estimated to affect up to one in five of us 508 00:24:50,640 --> 00:24:52,760 at some point in our lives. 509 00:24:52,760 --> 00:24:56,080 Irritable bowel syndrome is the name we give to a collection of symptoms 510 00:24:56,080 --> 00:24:59,840 that include tummy ache, diarrhoea, constipation as well as bloating. 511 00:24:59,840 --> 00:25:03,720 The abdominal swelling we call bloating can be extremely painful, 512 00:25:03,720 --> 00:25:07,440 so if you're prone, steer clear of such wind-inducing foods 513 00:25:07,440 --> 00:25:09,680 as not just the notorious baked bean 514 00:25:09,680 --> 00:25:12,880 but cabbage, cauliflower and even some fruits. 515 00:25:12,880 --> 00:25:16,760 Now, the fruits that can cause this are things like apples and plums. 516 00:25:16,760 --> 00:25:19,120 And instead of apples and plums, you might want to have 517 00:25:19,120 --> 00:25:20,800 fruits such as bananas and oranges. 518 00:25:20,800 --> 00:25:23,400 Those same uncomfortable symptoms can occur 519 00:25:23,400 --> 00:25:25,560 if you have an intolerance to dairy. 520 00:25:25,560 --> 00:25:28,120 Milk contains a sugar called lactose. 521 00:25:28,120 --> 00:25:30,360 Lactose can be very difficult to break down 522 00:25:30,360 --> 00:25:31,800 for a lot of IBS sufferers. 523 00:25:31,800 --> 00:25:35,720 Stopping having lactose and actually having milks without lactose, 524 00:25:35,720 --> 00:25:38,080 such as lactose-free milk or soya milk, 525 00:25:38,080 --> 00:25:39,960 can often help with your symptoms. 526 00:25:39,960 --> 00:25:42,880 As we'll see later, another everyday food 527 00:25:42,880 --> 00:25:47,120 that is often much maligned can also worsen wind and abdominal cramps 528 00:25:47,120 --> 00:25:49,560 if you've got a sensitivity to gluten. 529 00:25:49,560 --> 00:25:51,400 Bread which contains wheat 530 00:25:51,400 --> 00:25:53,800 can often be difficult for the gut to break down, 531 00:25:53,800 --> 00:25:55,040 so instead of these, 532 00:25:55,040 --> 00:25:58,200 you may want to go for some wheat-free substitutes instead. 533 00:25:58,200 --> 00:26:00,840 IBS sufferers who are sensitive to wheat 534 00:26:00,840 --> 00:26:03,560 can get that vital fibre instead from nuts, 535 00:26:03,560 --> 00:26:06,080 leafy green veg like kale and spinach, 536 00:26:06,080 --> 00:26:11,120 and best of all, ground flaxseed, easy to sprinkle on top of a yogurt. 537 00:26:11,120 --> 00:26:14,320 And the good doctor has another tip we can all take on board, 538 00:26:14,320 --> 00:26:17,240 whether we have digestive problems or not. 539 00:26:17,240 --> 00:26:19,760 It's not just changing what you eat, but when you eat. 540 00:26:19,760 --> 00:26:23,040 Try not to eat anything three hours before you go to bed. 541 00:26:23,040 --> 00:26:26,240 Going to bed with a full stomach is going to increase the risk that 542 00:26:26,240 --> 00:26:30,040 you push stomach acid out of your stomach and into your oesophagus. 543 00:26:30,040 --> 00:26:32,320 Add to that the advice your mother used to say - 544 00:26:32,320 --> 00:26:35,200 don't wolf your dinner down - and you should be able to enjoy 545 00:26:35,200 --> 00:26:38,080 eating good food without the bad effects. 546 00:26:45,160 --> 00:26:46,800 Next, our daily bread! 547 00:26:46,800 --> 00:26:49,720 So, Chris, what would it be for you? Would it be ordinary white bread 548 00:26:49,720 --> 00:26:51,760 or would it be big, fat, chunky wholemeal? 549 00:26:51,760 --> 00:26:55,600 Do you know what? I don't mind either, actually, but for some things it has to be white bread. 550 00:26:55,600 --> 00:26:57,840 So if I was having a bacon sandwich, it would have to be 551 00:26:57,840 --> 00:27:01,520 - on a sliced white. - Nothing else would do? - I don't think it would taste the same. 552 00:27:01,520 --> 00:27:04,120 The nation, apparently, is falling out of love with bread, 553 00:27:04,120 --> 00:27:06,800 because a lot of the headlines say that it makes you fat. 554 00:27:06,800 --> 00:27:10,080 And I have to admit, I have cut back as much as I can on bread - 555 00:27:10,080 --> 00:27:12,400 and she pulls her stomach in! HE LAUGHS 556 00:27:12,400 --> 00:27:14,080 So, should we be avoiding it? 557 00:27:14,080 --> 00:27:17,520 Or do you think there's more to the humble loaf than meets the eye? 558 00:27:17,520 --> 00:27:20,400 Well, there's definitely more to some loaves than meets the eye. 559 00:27:20,400 --> 00:27:22,760 And there's one type in particular that you may well 560 00:27:22,760 --> 00:27:25,320 change your mind about after watching this. 561 00:27:26,840 --> 00:27:30,800 We used to love these conveniently packaged loaves so much 562 00:27:30,800 --> 00:27:33,160 that we judged everything else against them, 563 00:27:33,160 --> 00:27:35,240 describing the most impressive new ideas 564 00:27:35,240 --> 00:27:37,560 as "the best thing since sliced bread". 565 00:27:37,560 --> 00:27:39,200 But things have changed. 566 00:27:39,200 --> 00:27:44,200 In 2015, we spent almost £100 million less on sliced bread 567 00:27:44,200 --> 00:27:46,200 than we did just a year earlier. 568 00:27:46,200 --> 00:27:49,400 And while many of us do still love our daily bread, 569 00:27:49,400 --> 00:27:52,920 the decline in popularity of some of our best-known varieties 570 00:27:52,920 --> 00:27:56,680 reflects growing concerns that bread is just not good for us. 571 00:27:56,680 --> 00:27:59,120 - I love bread. I absolutely do. - SHE LAUGHS 572 00:27:59,120 --> 00:28:01,480 Unfortunately for my waistline, yeah, I like bread. 573 00:28:01,480 --> 00:28:03,320 I'd eat it every day if I could. 574 00:28:03,320 --> 00:28:05,320 Bread's one of those things everybody eats. 575 00:28:05,320 --> 00:28:08,160 And if you want to grab something quick, it's a sandwich, 576 00:28:08,160 --> 00:28:10,560 it's generally a bread type of product. 577 00:28:10,560 --> 00:28:14,320 I think, like, I try and be healthier 578 00:28:14,320 --> 00:28:16,840 by choosing brown over white, 579 00:28:16,840 --> 00:28:20,160 but really, is that any healthier? 580 00:28:21,560 --> 00:28:23,240 Well, now, there's a question. 581 00:28:23,240 --> 00:28:25,960 Because while we're buying less bread across the board, 582 00:28:25,960 --> 00:28:29,080 we still buy twice as much sliced white bread than brown, 583 00:28:29,080 --> 00:28:32,200 even though white bread is considered less healthy. 584 00:28:32,200 --> 00:28:36,280 But is white really the nutritional poor relation we often think it is? 585 00:28:36,280 --> 00:28:39,600 Well, I've set up my own bread stall in a Cambridge market, 586 00:28:39,600 --> 00:28:42,160 and I'm asking passing shoppers which type 587 00:28:42,160 --> 00:28:45,080 is most likely to end up in their basket. 588 00:28:45,080 --> 00:28:48,360 So, out of this, which bread would you buy? 589 00:28:51,040 --> 00:28:53,400 So I have four different sliced loaves - 590 00:28:53,400 --> 00:28:54,880 a value sliced white, 591 00:28:54,880 --> 00:28:56,840 a medium-priced white toastie, 592 00:28:56,840 --> 00:28:59,160 a mid-priced loaf of sliced wholemeal, 593 00:28:59,160 --> 00:29:01,760 and a premium seeded loaf. 594 00:29:01,760 --> 00:29:03,960 Which bread do you buy, out of this table? 595 00:29:03,960 --> 00:29:07,200 I have to buy two, cos my children don't like wholemeal, 596 00:29:07,200 --> 00:29:09,240 so I have white and wholemeal. 597 00:29:09,240 --> 00:29:11,640 And what do you think is the difference between the two? 598 00:29:11,640 --> 00:29:14,400 I mean, apart from the fact that one's brown and one's white! 599 00:29:14,400 --> 00:29:16,120 Well, this has more taste, obviously. 600 00:29:16,120 --> 00:29:18,120 This is healthier for you, really. 601 00:29:18,120 --> 00:29:21,120 Out of all these slices of bread, which one would you buy? 602 00:29:21,120 --> 00:29:24,400 - Ooh. This one. - This one? - Yeah, I would go for that one as well. 603 00:29:24,400 --> 00:29:27,120 - You both would buy the white. - Yeah. - Why's that? 604 00:29:27,120 --> 00:29:29,840 I like white bread a lot more, personally. 605 00:29:29,840 --> 00:29:34,080 I'd probably be buying the wholemeal of these, most likely. 606 00:29:34,080 --> 00:29:36,040 And do you ever buy white? 607 00:29:36,040 --> 00:29:38,920 - Yes, I do occasionally buy white. - Why's that? 608 00:29:40,160 --> 00:29:41,920 I think white tastes better. 609 00:29:41,920 --> 00:29:44,640 Do you think there's much difference, really, 610 00:29:44,640 --> 00:29:46,280 between the brown and the white? 611 00:29:46,280 --> 00:29:48,880 I know there's more fibre in the brown. 612 00:29:48,880 --> 00:29:51,080 But generally, bread is bread. 613 00:29:51,080 --> 00:29:54,440 It's carbohydrates - it's not necessary good for us 614 00:29:54,440 --> 00:29:56,760 in large quantities, whatever we choose. 615 00:29:58,440 --> 00:30:01,520 It's interesting - while most chose the wholemeal loaf, 616 00:30:01,520 --> 00:30:03,800 because they thought it would be better for them, 617 00:30:03,800 --> 00:30:07,120 they said they actually preferred the taste of the white. 618 00:30:07,120 --> 00:30:09,520 And it's true that wholemeal and seeded loaves 619 00:30:09,520 --> 00:30:10,960 are the healthier choice, 620 00:30:10,960 --> 00:30:14,280 but white is not exactly a nutritional no-go. 621 00:30:14,280 --> 00:30:17,320 It does contain more salt and sugar than other loaves, 622 00:30:17,320 --> 00:30:20,720 but it has less fat and calories than the brown. 623 00:30:20,720 --> 00:30:23,720 Well, this one actually is higher in calories than the white. 624 00:30:23,720 --> 00:30:26,520 - Really? - Yes. - Wow! - Does that surprise you? 625 00:30:26,520 --> 00:30:29,400 Yes, I would've thought, if anything, they were very similar. 626 00:30:29,400 --> 00:30:33,360 - This one has a few more calories in it than the white. - My word! 627 00:30:33,360 --> 00:30:36,120 So you really don't know what you're eating nowadays, do you? 628 00:30:36,120 --> 00:30:38,840 I'm so took back with that. That's mad. 629 00:30:38,840 --> 00:30:43,000 Those higher calories come from good fats and fibre, thanks to the seeds 630 00:30:43,000 --> 00:30:47,320 and wholemeal flour, something that the white simply can't compete on. 631 00:30:47,320 --> 00:30:49,920 But it puts up a better fight on other fronts. 632 00:30:49,920 --> 00:30:53,000 Looking back, white bread has been made to be good for us 633 00:30:53,000 --> 00:30:54,920 ever since the Second World War, 634 00:30:54,920 --> 00:30:57,720 when the Government started fortifying the typical loaf 635 00:30:57,720 --> 00:30:59,920 with added vitamins and minerals. 636 00:30:59,920 --> 00:31:04,600 Even today, white bread is fortified with calcium, iron and B vitamins, 637 00:31:04,600 --> 00:31:09,200 and in some cases can contain more calcium than its wholemeal cousins. 638 00:31:09,200 --> 00:31:12,600 That's just one of the reasons Linia Patel, who's a nutritionist, 639 00:31:12,600 --> 00:31:15,800 believes that bread of whatever colour can be good for us. 640 00:31:15,800 --> 00:31:18,320 So, very commonly, people come to me and they say 641 00:31:18,320 --> 00:31:20,840 they're not eating bread because bread is fattening. 642 00:31:20,840 --> 00:31:22,280 I think it's just a myth. 643 00:31:22,280 --> 00:31:25,000 I think we associate bread being a carbohydrate 644 00:31:25,000 --> 00:31:28,200 and we associate carbohydrates being fattening for us. 645 00:31:28,200 --> 00:31:30,240 Actually, that's not the case. 646 00:31:30,240 --> 00:31:33,520 Bread can definitely be healthy and it's got key ingredients, 647 00:31:33,520 --> 00:31:35,680 so it's a good source of fibre. 648 00:31:35,680 --> 00:31:38,640 Also, if you're going for a higher-fibre bread, 649 00:31:38,640 --> 00:31:42,440 you're going to get B vitamins, minerals like iron and magnesium. 650 00:31:42,440 --> 00:31:47,760 While white bread does contain fibre, whole-wheat can contain three 651 00:31:47,760 --> 00:31:51,920 or four times as much, something we don't eat enough of in the UK. 652 00:31:51,920 --> 00:31:55,200 That may be why, in an attempt to tackle declining sales, 653 00:31:55,200 --> 00:31:58,800 M&S recently announced it would be adding fibre to all its white bread 654 00:31:58,800 --> 00:32:01,360 and rolls to make them more nutritious. 655 00:32:01,360 --> 00:32:04,560 The store says it's "bread with benefits" is being introduced 656 00:32:04,560 --> 00:32:08,240 because the days of the traditional white loaf are numbered. 657 00:32:08,240 --> 00:32:12,000 But while it's true that we're now spoilt for alternatives, 658 00:32:12,000 --> 00:32:15,440 there's no escaping white bread is still the UK's favourite. 659 00:32:15,440 --> 00:32:17,680 And because we no longer buy it every day, 660 00:32:17,680 --> 00:32:20,640 we expect it to last longer than it used to. 661 00:32:20,640 --> 00:32:24,360 Morris Bakers in Chorley turns out tens of thousands of rolls 662 00:32:24,360 --> 00:32:26,240 and loaves every single week. 663 00:32:26,240 --> 00:32:30,200 That kind of mass production relies on speed, so this bread is made 664 00:32:30,200 --> 00:32:33,480 very differently to the traditional methods. 665 00:32:33,480 --> 00:32:35,680 The demand for a soft white loaf 666 00:32:35,680 --> 00:32:38,680 or the soft sandwich rolls, et cetera, 667 00:32:38,680 --> 00:32:42,280 is still massive, so to fulfil that demand 668 00:32:42,280 --> 00:32:46,960 we need to make it in a manner that puts out the big-time elements. 669 00:32:46,960 --> 00:32:50,120 Traditionally, bread dough needs to be left for anything up to 670 00:32:50,120 --> 00:32:53,800 three hours to let the yeast ferment and the bread to rise. 671 00:32:53,800 --> 00:32:55,240 But modern baking methods 672 00:32:55,240 --> 00:32:57,920 have cut that fermentation process right down, 673 00:32:57,920 --> 00:33:00,080 thanks to the use of additives 674 00:33:00,080 --> 00:33:02,440 that do the job in a fraction of the time. 675 00:33:02,440 --> 00:33:07,760 We need to add emulsifiers, fats and sugars and ascorbic acid, 676 00:33:07,760 --> 00:33:12,840 which help the dough to mature in a short period of time. 677 00:33:12,840 --> 00:33:16,400 The modern process not only cuts down the time it takes to produce 678 00:33:16,400 --> 00:33:19,880 one loaf from anything up to five hours to less than three, 679 00:33:19,880 --> 00:33:23,680 but it also means that bread has a longer shelf life. 680 00:33:23,680 --> 00:33:27,000 The major benefit of making bread this way is that the consumer 681 00:33:27,000 --> 00:33:29,520 gets a loaf, as long as they keep it wrapped up, 682 00:33:29,520 --> 00:33:32,240 they can keep it for a number of days 683 00:33:32,240 --> 00:33:34,120 and they are having little waste. 684 00:33:35,160 --> 00:33:37,320 Many of the natural nutrients are lost 685 00:33:37,320 --> 00:33:41,160 when flour is milled for white bread, but because it's the law that 686 00:33:41,160 --> 00:33:45,280 our white loaves must have all that extra calcium, iron and B vitamins, 687 00:33:45,280 --> 00:33:49,200 on balance, experts say there's no significant difference between 688 00:33:49,200 --> 00:33:52,840 the nutritional content of a traditional loaf and a modern one. 689 00:33:52,840 --> 00:33:56,800 But whether it's white, wholemeal, gluten free or rye, 690 00:33:56,800 --> 00:34:01,480 the bread Linia crowns best of all is the kind you make yourself. 691 00:34:01,480 --> 00:34:03,720 Go home and try bake your own bread 692 00:34:03,720 --> 00:34:07,280 or if you can't do that, just go to your local baker, 693 00:34:07,280 --> 00:34:10,000 because what you're going to get is you're going to get bread 694 00:34:10,000 --> 00:34:12,360 that just has five basic ingredients. 695 00:34:12,360 --> 00:34:15,720 Your flour, your yeast, your oil, your salt and your water. 696 00:34:16,760 --> 00:34:18,600 And if that's not practical, 697 00:34:18,600 --> 00:34:21,560 one reason why sales of mass-produced sliced bread 698 00:34:21,560 --> 00:34:23,040 have been declining is 699 00:34:23,040 --> 00:34:25,920 because more people have switched to buying bread from a part of 700 00:34:25,920 --> 00:34:29,800 the supermarket where you'll find a simpler, fresher loaf. 701 00:34:29,800 --> 00:34:32,600 If you go to the supermarket's bakery 702 00:34:32,600 --> 00:34:35,440 and get one of the loaves that's freshly baked, 703 00:34:35,440 --> 00:34:39,240 that's going to be better for you than actually buying a loaf of bread 704 00:34:39,240 --> 00:34:42,600 that are going to be pre-packed in the supermarket. 705 00:34:42,600 --> 00:34:45,480 Of course that goes for all loaves, not just white, 706 00:34:45,480 --> 00:34:48,520 and whilst it seems that the white-sliced loaf isn't quite 707 00:34:48,520 --> 00:34:51,240 the nutritional no-go area it's often thought to be, 708 00:34:51,240 --> 00:34:53,560 Linia's own choice would always be something 709 00:34:53,560 --> 00:34:55,360 that's little bit more wholesome. 710 00:34:55,360 --> 00:34:57,480 Go for something wholegrain and seeded 711 00:34:57,480 --> 00:35:00,320 because what we get in the wholegrain and seeded is fibre. 712 00:35:00,320 --> 00:35:02,120 Now, fibre is a really important nutrient 713 00:35:02,120 --> 00:35:03,520 that helps our guts work better, 714 00:35:03,520 --> 00:35:05,920 but it also helps balance our blood sugar levels 715 00:35:05,920 --> 00:35:08,000 and control our appetite, which is essential 716 00:35:08,000 --> 00:35:11,640 if we're managing our weight or if you just want to be healthier. 717 00:35:18,840 --> 00:35:22,080 Now, earlier I found out how 30 years of health advice 718 00:35:22,080 --> 00:35:24,120 telling us not to eat certain fats 719 00:35:24,120 --> 00:35:28,040 because they'd cause heart disease has now been disproven, meaning 720 00:35:28,040 --> 00:35:31,800 we shouldn't worry about putting some good old-fashioned fats 721 00:35:31,800 --> 00:35:32,960 back on the menu. 722 00:35:32,960 --> 00:35:36,520 The same thing happened with eggs and the health message this time, 723 00:35:36,520 --> 00:35:40,080 though again has been disproven, has been a very tough one to shake. 724 00:35:41,960 --> 00:35:45,080 When I was growing up, eggs were the original superfood, 725 00:35:45,080 --> 00:35:47,960 before the term had even been coined. 726 00:35:47,960 --> 00:35:51,280 Eggs is cheap, full of proteins, 727 00:35:51,280 --> 00:35:54,840 and what's more, they helps you to face up to the day. 728 00:35:54,840 --> 00:35:56,680 And to face up to her, I need 'em. 729 00:35:56,680 --> 00:36:00,720 Ah, yes, there's a lot more goodness in eggs than people realise. 730 00:36:01,760 --> 00:36:06,480 Marvellous. In the 1960s, we ate up to five eggs a week each. 731 00:36:06,480 --> 00:36:10,480 But less that 20 years later, the mighty egg fell from grace. 732 00:36:10,480 --> 00:36:15,480 In 1988, the then Health Secretary Edwina Currie announced that most of 733 00:36:15,480 --> 00:36:17,600 the egg production in the country at the time 734 00:36:17,600 --> 00:36:19,400 was affected with salmonella. 735 00:36:19,400 --> 00:36:21,560 The advice is not to eat raw eggs 736 00:36:21,560 --> 00:36:24,120 or uncooked food containing raw eggs. 737 00:36:24,120 --> 00:36:27,120 To be absolutely safe, they should be hard boiled... 738 00:36:27,120 --> 00:36:29,040 despite consumer resistance. 739 00:36:30,360 --> 00:36:34,520 Egg sales fell 60% overnight and didn't recover 740 00:36:34,520 --> 00:36:37,320 because shortly after came more bad news. 741 00:36:37,320 --> 00:36:40,200 We were told that eggs were packed with cholesterol, 742 00:36:40,200 --> 00:36:43,680 which caused heart disease, so we should limit how many we ate. 743 00:36:43,680 --> 00:36:45,600 And as recently as 2012, 744 00:36:45,600 --> 00:36:47,720 one headline even declared eggs 745 00:36:47,720 --> 00:36:49,680 that were as bad for you as smoking. 746 00:36:49,680 --> 00:36:51,080 The yolk is what they're saying 747 00:36:51,080 --> 00:36:54,360 is bad for you, in terms of eggs now, from what I've been reading. 748 00:36:54,360 --> 00:36:57,440 The white is what everyone is going crazy about. 749 00:36:57,440 --> 00:37:00,480 Well, I think we've reached a point that you're actually frightened 750 00:37:00,480 --> 00:37:03,640 to know what you can eat any more, cos of all the headlines, 751 00:37:03,640 --> 00:37:06,200 you think, "Oh, my God, today I can't eat bacon, 752 00:37:06,200 --> 00:37:09,880 - "tomorrow I can't eat gluten." - Eggs or dairy. 753 00:37:09,880 --> 00:37:13,840 So I think everybody is really quite confused about what to eat. 754 00:37:13,840 --> 00:37:17,680 It's a similar scare story to the one we heard about earlier, 755 00:37:17,680 --> 00:37:20,320 which turned us away from saturated fats. 756 00:37:20,320 --> 00:37:22,200 But in this case it was worse 757 00:37:22,200 --> 00:37:24,920 because while eating too many saturated fats, 758 00:37:24,920 --> 00:37:27,640 or indeed any fats, still isn't a good idea, 759 00:37:27,640 --> 00:37:30,360 when it comes to eggs, it now seems that all 760 00:37:30,360 --> 00:37:34,040 the time they were as healthy as we'd been told in the first place. 761 00:37:34,040 --> 00:37:36,280 So to find out if one of my favourite foods 762 00:37:36,280 --> 00:37:38,880 is all it's cracked up to be, I've come back to see 763 00:37:38,880 --> 00:37:42,560 Prof Bruce Griffin at the University of Surrey. 764 00:37:42,560 --> 00:37:45,280 Professor, for many years now we've heard the controversy, 765 00:37:45,280 --> 00:37:47,200 too many eggs are not good. 766 00:37:47,200 --> 00:37:50,440 Where do you stand on the mechanics of all that? 767 00:37:50,440 --> 00:37:53,600 Well, for many years, there was this popular misunderstanding that 768 00:37:53,600 --> 00:37:55,000 the cholesterol in eggs, 769 00:37:55,000 --> 00:37:57,560 which is actually contained in the egg yolk, 770 00:37:57,560 --> 00:38:00,520 is the same as cholesterol that gets into our arteries 771 00:38:00,520 --> 00:38:03,960 and causes heart disease, and they're really not the same thing. 772 00:38:03,960 --> 00:38:07,440 When scientists began to study the link between cholesterol 773 00:38:07,440 --> 00:38:09,400 and heart disease in the '70s, 774 00:38:09,400 --> 00:38:12,160 any foods high in cholesterol became suspect. 775 00:38:12,160 --> 00:38:15,440 And with one egg containing two-thirds of your recommended 776 00:38:15,440 --> 00:38:18,920 daily amount, it's no surprise that they very quickly found themselves 777 00:38:18,920 --> 00:38:20,520 off the breakfast table. 778 00:38:20,520 --> 00:38:22,640 But the science simply wasn't sound. 779 00:38:22,640 --> 00:38:25,600 There was no evidence to suggest that the cholesterol in eggs 780 00:38:25,600 --> 00:38:30,160 was leading to increased coronary disease and coronary heart disease. 781 00:38:30,160 --> 00:38:33,520 We've now found out that the amount of saturated fat 782 00:38:33,520 --> 00:38:36,400 has a much greater effect on your blood cholesterol than 783 00:38:36,400 --> 00:38:41,080 the relatively small amounts of cholesterol in food like eggs. 784 00:38:41,080 --> 00:38:44,160 And that's what's behind the change in advice. 785 00:38:44,160 --> 00:38:47,760 It had previously been assumed that eggs and saturated fats 786 00:38:47,760 --> 00:38:51,320 both had a similar effect on the level of cholesterol in your blood. 787 00:38:51,320 --> 00:38:52,880 But that's not the case. 788 00:38:52,880 --> 00:38:56,800 And it's now accepted that saturated fats have a much bigger impact. 789 00:38:56,800 --> 00:39:00,840 So eggs, which result in far less cholesterol remaining in your blood, 790 00:39:00,840 --> 00:39:02,360 are off the hook. 791 00:39:02,360 --> 00:39:06,240 And yet, in the '80s and '90s, we were giving up eggs in our droves 792 00:39:06,240 --> 00:39:09,000 because we were told that more than three or four eggs a week 793 00:39:09,000 --> 00:39:10,440 would be bad for us. 794 00:39:10,440 --> 00:39:14,280 That had a devastating impact on egg farmers like David Brass. 795 00:39:14,280 --> 00:39:17,480 In the mid to late '80s, we had all sorts of scares - 796 00:39:17,480 --> 00:39:20,200 cholesterol in eggs was bad for you, eggs are bad for you, 797 00:39:20,200 --> 00:39:23,160 because there's fats in them, and Edwina did her bit 798 00:39:23,160 --> 00:39:27,200 and we saw the bottom of the market then, I guess. Then the market was 799 00:39:27,200 --> 00:39:30,640 very stable. It didn't grow much at all for years and years and years. 800 00:39:30,640 --> 00:39:32,360 It took until 2009 801 00:39:32,360 --> 00:39:33,920 for business to improve, 802 00:39:33,920 --> 00:39:35,360 after headlines like these 803 00:39:35,360 --> 00:39:36,680 proclaimed not only that 804 00:39:36,680 --> 00:39:38,560 eggs could now go back on the menu, 805 00:39:38,560 --> 00:39:41,520 but even that it was safe to eat them every day. 806 00:39:41,520 --> 00:39:44,040 And ever since, the good news has kept coming. 807 00:39:44,040 --> 00:39:48,160 It was a massive change in advice, and it seems extraordinary now 808 00:39:48,160 --> 00:39:51,400 that we'd been so put off of food that does us so much good. 809 00:39:51,400 --> 00:39:55,640 Eggs are designed to support life, so they contain a very 810 00:39:55,640 --> 00:39:57,760 broad profile of micronutrients 811 00:39:57,760 --> 00:40:01,400 and a very high grade of protein as well. 812 00:40:01,400 --> 00:40:03,200 If there was to be a superfood, 813 00:40:03,200 --> 00:40:07,080 an egg has to be the superfood because of its nutrient composition. 814 00:40:07,080 --> 00:40:10,120 So I could have as many eggs as I want per week, give or take? 815 00:40:10,120 --> 00:40:13,320 Well, it's perfectly safe to have up to seven eggs a week 816 00:40:13,320 --> 00:40:15,200 or an egg a day, as we used to say. 817 00:40:15,200 --> 00:40:18,080 "Go to work on an egg" used to be a famous slogan 818 00:40:18,080 --> 00:40:20,680 and that certainly isn't going to cause us any harm, 819 00:40:20,680 --> 00:40:23,240 but we don't want to eat anything in excess. 820 00:40:23,240 --> 00:40:27,120 I have to say, that old slogan "go to work on an egg", actually, 821 00:40:27,120 --> 00:40:31,800 I genuinely find that I work well on eggs. How good are they for you? 822 00:40:31,800 --> 00:40:34,880 Well, they are an excellent source of dietary protein, 823 00:40:34,880 --> 00:40:38,200 and we've just completed some studies to show that 824 00:40:38,200 --> 00:40:43,000 the dietary protein can actually suppress your appetite throughout 825 00:40:43,000 --> 00:40:47,520 the day and increase that feeling of fullness, so you tend to snack less. 826 00:40:47,520 --> 00:40:49,240 And what's it better than? 827 00:40:49,240 --> 00:40:52,200 Well, the protein in an egg, for example, 828 00:40:52,200 --> 00:40:54,880 is more bio available to us than 829 00:40:54,880 --> 00:40:57,840 the protein you get from fillet steak, for example. 830 00:40:57,840 --> 00:40:59,880 Better than a fillet steak? 831 00:40:59,880 --> 00:41:02,960 Better than a fillet steak, with respect to protein. 832 00:41:02,960 --> 00:41:06,120 Well, well. I've long been a fan of eggs, 833 00:41:06,120 --> 00:41:09,280 but that comparison with steak I'd never heard before. 834 00:41:09,280 --> 00:41:12,600 And I must say, I've been sharing it with people ever since I heard it. 835 00:41:12,600 --> 00:41:15,520 But off the back of that much more positive health message, 836 00:41:15,520 --> 00:41:18,800 sales of eggs have been rising, and as a nation we now bake, 837 00:41:18,800 --> 00:41:22,560 boil, scramble and poach almost a billion of them every month. 838 00:41:22,560 --> 00:41:25,240 That's great news for producers such as David. 839 00:41:25,240 --> 00:41:28,040 The market has grown almost exponentially in the 840 00:41:28,040 --> 00:41:30,400 last couple of years, it's a wonderful place to be. 841 00:41:30,400 --> 00:41:33,200 The last 12 months has been almost like a perfect storm, 842 00:41:33,200 --> 00:41:36,480 more and more good news about eggs, so we sell more because of that. 843 00:41:36,480 --> 00:41:38,040 You just can't get the eggs. 844 00:41:38,040 --> 00:41:39,720 The stores are empty all the time, 845 00:41:39,720 --> 00:41:42,440 double-digit growth month after month after month. 846 00:41:42,440 --> 00:41:44,440 The egg industry is booming again. 847 00:41:44,440 --> 00:41:47,000 But of course when advice on an issue like this 848 00:41:47,000 --> 00:41:50,360 changes in such a dramatic way, it can cause real confusion. 849 00:41:50,360 --> 00:41:52,880 I'm old enough to have been through, "It was good for you, 850 00:41:52,880 --> 00:41:54,960 "now it's bad for you, now it's good for you," 851 00:41:54,960 --> 00:41:58,320 so I just don't take any notice, I just don't listen to them. 852 00:41:58,320 --> 00:42:01,280 Thing is, they do a big issue on, like, 853 00:42:01,280 --> 00:42:05,360 "Don't eat eggs. Don't do this, don't do that, don't do the other." 854 00:42:05,360 --> 00:42:07,600 So everybody doesn't do it, 855 00:42:07,600 --> 00:42:11,680 but 12 months down the line, when you've given up something 856 00:42:11,680 --> 00:42:14,040 that you quite like, then they say, 857 00:42:14,040 --> 00:42:17,640 - "We're sorry, we got it wrong." - "Eggs are all right." 858 00:42:17,640 --> 00:42:19,440 "Eggs are all right to eat." 859 00:42:19,440 --> 00:42:22,720 I think, in another study a few years ago, it said, 860 00:42:22,720 --> 00:42:25,280 "Too many eggs will cause you cholesterol," 861 00:42:25,280 --> 00:42:27,560 but now it's, "Eggs are fine." 862 00:42:27,560 --> 00:42:33,120 Again, it's just that flip-flop media sensationalism. 863 00:42:33,120 --> 00:42:37,160 The reality is that science just doesn't stand still. 864 00:42:37,160 --> 00:42:40,240 And when new information is discovered or released, 865 00:42:40,240 --> 00:42:44,280 the coverage it gets can sometimes end up muddying the real message. 866 00:42:44,280 --> 00:42:47,840 Do you find it as frustrating as the general public, 867 00:42:47,840 --> 00:42:50,720 the way the studies sort of change their mind all the time? 868 00:42:50,720 --> 00:42:52,320 It's not really new information. 869 00:42:52,320 --> 00:42:55,080 It's just looking at old studies and re-examining old data 870 00:42:55,080 --> 00:42:58,480 and finding that when you remove the effects of saturated fat 871 00:42:58,480 --> 00:43:01,480 and you look at dietary cholesterol in isolation, 872 00:43:01,480 --> 00:43:03,640 it has a relatively small effect. 873 00:43:03,640 --> 00:43:06,640 Eggs is full of proteins, very economical and... 874 00:43:06,640 --> 00:43:08,960 Full of nourishment and wonderful value for money. 875 00:43:08,960 --> 00:43:11,240 'We may not yet be eating quite as many eggs as we did in 876 00:43:11,240 --> 00:43:12,920 'Tony Hancock's day, 877 00:43:12,920 --> 00:43:15,600 'but maybe it's time to wheel out those old ads once again.' 878 00:43:15,600 --> 00:43:18,280 Look, six eggs and only five soldiers. 879 00:43:24,400 --> 00:43:27,840 It can be extremely frustrating not to mention confusing 880 00:43:27,840 --> 00:43:30,920 when new reports pop up out of the blue saying the complete opposite 881 00:43:30,920 --> 00:43:33,120 of things we've long believed to be true. 882 00:43:33,120 --> 00:43:35,280 Now, the tricky thing of course can be knowing 883 00:43:35,280 --> 00:43:38,400 which new advice to follow and which to take with a dose of salt. 884 00:43:38,400 --> 00:43:41,880 And while hopefully we've helped you a little bit with that today, 885 00:43:41,880 --> 00:43:44,680 if in doubt, take a common-sense approach before 886 00:43:44,680 --> 00:43:47,240 - cutting something out of your diet entirely. - Absolutely. 887 00:43:47,240 --> 00:43:50,800 If you only eat the food that's suddenly bad every now and then, 888 00:43:50,800 --> 00:43:53,720 well, that's usually going to be fine to carry on doing so. 889 00:43:53,720 --> 00:43:56,480 But just remember, you'll find more on some of the topics 890 00:43:56,480 --> 00:44:00,560 we're discussing throughout this series at bbc.co.uk/food 891 00:44:00,560 --> 00:44:02,680 But I'm afraid that's all from us now. 892 00:44:02,680 --> 00:44:05,920 - Until the next time, goodbye. - Thank you for your company, bye-bye.