1 00:00:00,100 --> 00:00:03,000 MUSIC: Head Over Heels by Tears For Fears 2 00:00:17,500 --> 00:00:22,380 This is not an astronaut. This is a crypto billionaire. 3 00:00:26,860 --> 00:00:30,300 Justin Sun is one of the many tech billionaires 4 00:00:30,300 --> 00:00:31,940 who are now so rich 5 00:00:31,940 --> 00:00:34,820 that they can travel to space for fun. 6 00:01:00,460 --> 00:01:04,220 There are more billionaires now than ever before, 7 00:01:04,220 --> 00:01:07,340 and their wealth is growing fast. 8 00:01:07,340 --> 00:01:10,540 The 12 richest people in the world now own almost 9 00:01:10,540 --> 00:01:14,380 the same total wealth as the bottom half of humanity. 10 00:01:16,900 --> 00:01:20,460 Most of this is driven by tech billionaires, 11 00:01:20,460 --> 00:01:23,140 whose individual fortunes are now beginning 12 00:01:23,140 --> 00:01:26,460 to rival the power of entire governments. 13 00:01:26,460 --> 00:01:28,060 Lib, lib, lib to the First Lady. 14 00:01:30,220 --> 00:01:33,820 Over the past year, I've met with tech billionaires... 15 00:01:33,820 --> 00:01:35,740 Great to meet you. - Nice to see you. 16 00:01:35,740 --> 00:01:39,580 - ..to find out how they plan to reshape our world. 17 00:01:39,580 --> 00:01:41,980 - Governments are stuck. 18 00:01:41,980 --> 00:01:44,460 - Among them, there's a growing movement 19 00:01:44,460 --> 00:01:47,380 that sees the nation state itself 20 00:01:47,380 --> 00:01:51,940 as an outdated operating system in need of an update. 21 00:01:51,940 --> 00:01:53,620 - Silicon Valley regards itself 22 00:01:53,620 --> 00:01:55,980 as like the best in making things happen. 23 00:01:55,980 --> 00:01:58,380 - I've seen how they're using technology 24 00:01:58,380 --> 00:02:00,900 to replace our financial systems... 25 00:02:00,900 --> 00:02:03,020 Do you feel like crypto has finally taken over Wall Street? 26 00:02:05,340 --> 00:02:07,380 ..rewrite our political systems... 27 00:02:07,380 --> 00:02:10,500 - In short order, it's become a wave of money. 28 00:02:10,500 --> 00:02:13,740 - ..and create independent states of their own. 29 00:02:13,740 --> 00:02:15,660 - I appreciate your commitment 30 00:02:15,660 --> 00:02:18,100 to building the freest country on the planet. 31 00:02:18,100 --> 00:02:19,700 - Thank you, Mr President. 32 00:02:19,700 --> 00:02:23,260 - Is this the era of the tech billionaire takeover? 33 00:02:25,060 --> 00:02:28,220 And what have they got planned for all of us? 34 00:02:28,220 --> 00:02:32,460 MUSIC: Money by The Flying Lizards 35 00:02:46,020 --> 00:02:49,460 If we are in the era of the tech billionaire takeover, 36 00:02:49,460 --> 00:02:53,060 few people illustrate this more than Justin Sun. 37 00:02:56,380 --> 00:02:58,380 As well as travelling to space, 38 00:02:58,380 --> 00:03:01,220 Justin Sun also bought this banana 39 00:03:01,220 --> 00:03:04,020 for over $6 million... 40 00:03:04,020 --> 00:03:05,180 ..and then ate it. 41 00:03:06,460 --> 00:03:10,380 This Chinese crypto entrepreneur loves outlandish stunts. 42 00:03:10,380 --> 00:03:13,180 - $4.6 million for the Glide Foundation's 43 00:03:13,180 --> 00:03:15,540 annual charity auction with lunch for Warren Buffett. 44 00:03:15,540 --> 00:03:20,180 - He's also accused of fraud, market manipulation and creating 45 00:03:20,180 --> 00:03:22,900 the go-to crypto platform for criminals, 46 00:03:22,900 --> 00:03:24,260 drug traffickers 47 00:03:24,260 --> 00:03:28,580 and mafia organisations to store their billions. 48 00:03:28,580 --> 00:03:30,340 Despite the bad press, 49 00:03:30,340 --> 00:03:32,700 Sun is a leading figure in a movement 50 00:03:32,700 --> 00:03:36,660 that believes crypto is on the brink of replacing money, 51 00:03:36,660 --> 00:03:38,660 setting people free from the control 52 00:03:38,660 --> 00:03:41,540 of big banks and tyrannical governments. 53 00:03:49,820 --> 00:03:51,740 But people really started to take notice 54 00:03:51,740 --> 00:03:54,860 of Sun last year when he invested millions 55 00:03:54,860 --> 00:03:57,740 in the Trump family's new crypto business. 56 00:03:57,740 --> 00:04:01,420 In return, Sun not only won a VIP reception 57 00:04:01,420 --> 00:04:04,220 and private dinner with Trump himself, 58 00:04:04,220 --> 00:04:07,500 but a chance to enter the world of the establishment. 59 00:04:14,260 --> 00:04:18,580 MUSIC: Head Over Heels by Tears For Fears 60 00:04:21,540 --> 00:04:25,820 I'm in New York to meet Justin Sun as he takes his biggest step yet 61 00:04:25,820 --> 00:04:27,460 in achieving one of the ultimate 62 00:04:27,460 --> 00:04:31,740 marks of financial legitimacy, launching his company Tron 63 00:04:31,740 --> 00:04:35,500 on the world's most prestigious tech stock exchange, 64 00:04:35,500 --> 00:04:36,980 the Nasdaq. 65 00:04:36,980 --> 00:04:41,700 - # Something happens and I'm head over heels... # 66 00:04:41,700 --> 00:04:44,020 - Hello? Hi. How's it going? Hi. 67 00:04:46,540 --> 00:04:47,900 Hi. Hi. 68 00:04:49,820 --> 00:04:52,860 Hi, Justin. - Hi. - Hi. Good to meet you. 69 00:04:52,860 --> 00:04:53,940 - Good to meet you. 70 00:04:55,060 --> 00:04:57,540 - Forgive me for starting with such a blunt question, 71 00:04:57,540 --> 00:05:00,420 but how much are you personally worth? 72 00:05:00,420 --> 00:05:02,740 If you had to put an estimate on it, how much? 73 00:05:07,380 --> 00:05:08,980 OK, so you're 34 years old. 74 00:05:08,980 --> 00:05:14,220 What does it feel like to have $8.5 billion to your name? 75 00:05:26,820 --> 00:05:30,100 What do you think you personally are most famous for? 76 00:05:42,660 --> 00:05:47,340 Justin Sun's company, Tron, is what's called a blockchain, 77 00:05:47,340 --> 00:05:49,540 a global software network on which 78 00:05:49,540 --> 00:05:52,820 you can buy and sell cryptocurrencies. 79 00:05:52,820 --> 00:05:57,260 Unlike a bank, it isn't run by one single authority. 80 00:05:57,260 --> 00:05:59,180 It's decentralised. 81 00:05:59,180 --> 00:06:03,780 It exists across many computers, all around the world. 82 00:06:03,780 --> 00:06:07,500 This makes it harder to tax and regulate. 83 00:06:08,980 --> 00:06:10,780 Over $20 billion worth 84 00:06:10,780 --> 00:06:14,540 of transactions happen every day on Tron. 85 00:06:14,540 --> 00:06:17,820 That's five trillion a year. 86 00:06:17,820 --> 00:06:21,380 And now he's in business with the Trump family. 87 00:06:44,380 --> 00:06:46,780 You want to replace money, basically, with crypto? 88 00:06:46,780 --> 00:06:48,740 Is that your dream? 89 00:06:54,980 --> 00:06:56,980 - LAUGHTER - Good, good, good. 90 00:06:58,380 --> 00:07:02,580 If Justin has his way, the national currencies we now use, 91 00:07:02,580 --> 00:07:05,780 regulated and taxed by governments, will be replaced 92 00:07:05,780 --> 00:07:10,340 by cryptocurrencies created by people like him. 93 00:07:10,340 --> 00:07:12,460 Getting Tron on the Nasdaq 94 00:07:12,460 --> 00:07:15,540 brings him one step closer to achieving that goal. 95 00:07:16,740 --> 00:07:19,460 How are you feeling? Yeah? You excited? 96 00:07:19,460 --> 00:07:21,820 It's a big moment. - Good to see you. 97 00:07:21,820 --> 00:07:23,500 - So good to see you. - Welcome to Nasdaq. 98 00:07:23,500 --> 00:07:24,940 - Thank you. - It's great to have you here. 99 00:07:24,940 --> 00:07:26,820 - Thank you. - Congratulations on all your success. 100 00:07:26,820 --> 00:07:28,140 - Thank you. - It's wonderful. 101 00:07:28,140 --> 00:07:30,340 - Instead of the years of regulatory scrutiny 102 00:07:30,340 --> 00:07:34,340 most companies face in order to get listed on the Nasdaq, 103 00:07:34,340 --> 00:07:38,780 Sun used his vast crypto wealth to buy a struggling toy company 104 00:07:38,780 --> 00:07:43,020 that was already listed and simply changed its name to Tron. 105 00:07:49,260 --> 00:07:50,740 ANNOUNCER: - Are you ready?! 106 00:07:50,740 --> 00:07:52,220 - THEY CHEER 107 00:07:53,460 --> 00:07:55,260 ALL: - ..two, one... 108 00:07:55,260 --> 00:07:57,100 - THEY CHEER 109 00:07:59,860 --> 00:08:01,540 JUSTIN CHEERS 110 00:08:01,540 --> 00:08:03,940 - To the moon! 111 00:08:03,940 --> 00:08:05,140 - Yeah! 112 00:08:06,140 --> 00:08:07,300 - Justin, how does it feel? 113 00:08:08,660 --> 00:08:10,420 - Great. Feel great. - Do you feel like 114 00:08:10,420 --> 00:08:12,100 crypto has finally taken over Wall Street? 115 00:08:15,980 --> 00:08:18,100 Over half of all illicit 116 00:08:18,100 --> 00:08:21,700 crypto transactions reportedly happened on Tron. 117 00:08:21,700 --> 00:08:25,060 It was allegedly used by Hamas and Hezbollah. 118 00:08:25,060 --> 00:08:28,140 Now it's a publicly traded company. 119 00:08:29,260 --> 00:08:31,660 Tron has now become a publicly listed company despite 120 00:08:31,660 --> 00:08:34,740 all the criminal and legal accusations. 121 00:08:34,740 --> 00:08:36,180 What does that mean for you? 122 00:08:46,740 --> 00:08:49,460 Could you have done any of this without the current administration? 123 00:09:06,020 --> 00:09:09,860 Justin Sun seems to believe the current administration is now 124 00:09:09,860 --> 00:09:14,060 helping enact his dream of replacing money with crypto. 125 00:09:17,540 --> 00:09:21,620 - That's the shot right there. - So this is the exclusive 126 00:09:21,620 --> 00:09:25,780 merch to commemorate the Nasdaq bell being rung. 127 00:09:25,780 --> 00:09:31,860 And I'm told this is a real banana, 128 00:09:31,860 --> 00:09:34,140 but it has to be replaced every two to three days. 129 00:09:35,340 --> 00:09:39,300 So, yeah, I'm probably not going to hang that up on my wall, just 130 00:09:39,300 --> 00:09:43,100 because of the logistical difficulty of having to replace it. 131 00:09:47,900 --> 00:09:50,780 There was a prevailing sense that this represented 132 00:09:50,780 --> 00:09:53,980 the world of crypto kind of challenging the financial elites 133 00:09:53,980 --> 00:09:56,340 and taking over Wall Street. 134 00:09:56,340 --> 00:09:58,940 And there's a kind of revolutionary, 135 00:09:58,940 --> 00:10:00,500 rebellious sentiment there. 136 00:10:00,500 --> 00:10:02,900 But what seemed to occur to no-one in that room was 137 00:10:02,900 --> 00:10:05,500 that they kind of are the financial elite now. 138 00:10:05,500 --> 00:10:07,500 I mean, they are literally the wealthiest 139 00:10:07,500 --> 00:10:09,660 and most powerful people in the world. 140 00:10:14,580 --> 00:10:16,700 But it isn't just banks and money 141 00:10:16,700 --> 00:10:20,500 that crypto billionaires like Justin Sun want to replace. 142 00:10:20,500 --> 00:10:24,820 They believe that laws, voting and government itself can 143 00:10:24,820 --> 00:10:28,020 all become digital transactions on the blockchain. 144 00:10:29,660 --> 00:10:32,060 And Sun is already using his wealth 145 00:10:32,060 --> 00:10:34,580 and power to help build a new country 146 00:10:34,580 --> 00:10:36,780 that puts this theory to the test. 147 00:10:45,780 --> 00:10:46,820 Wow. 148 00:10:48,300 --> 00:10:52,500 And I understand that you were actually elected prime minister of 149 00:10:52,500 --> 00:10:55,940 a small micronation called Liberland using 150 00:10:55,940 --> 00:10:57,900 blockchain elections. Is that right? 151 00:11:11,140 --> 00:11:14,460 So a big part of this whole philosophy is that 152 00:11:14,460 --> 00:11:17,540 these technological innovations are challenging power. 153 00:11:17,540 --> 00:11:19,860 They're challenging a financial elite, 154 00:11:19,860 --> 00:11:22,140 a political elite. 155 00:11:22,140 --> 00:11:26,780 But is there also a risk that the people 156 00:11:26,780 --> 00:11:28,700 behind these technologies become 157 00:11:28,700 --> 00:11:31,940 the elite themselves, and they become the power structure? - Yes. 158 00:12:02,020 --> 00:12:04,860 - Liberland was founded by libertarians, 159 00:12:04,860 --> 00:12:09,380 and libertarians hate taxes, regulations and big government. 160 00:12:10,740 --> 00:12:11,980 Instead of trying to fight 161 00:12:11,980 --> 00:12:13,940 the government in their own countries, 162 00:12:13,940 --> 00:12:15,580 the Liberlanders realised 163 00:12:15,580 --> 00:12:19,220 they could use blockchain technology to just make their own, 164 00:12:19,220 --> 00:12:24,180 replacing pesky politicians and laws with compliant computer code. 165 00:12:36,620 --> 00:12:39,620 This tech libertarian utopia has attracted 166 00:12:39,620 --> 00:12:42,340 the support of around 30 billionaires, 167 00:12:42,340 --> 00:12:44,540 many of them from the world of crypto. 168 00:12:50,100 --> 00:12:53,140 When Liberland's president Vit Jedlicka 169 00:12:53,140 --> 00:12:55,660 found a muddy bit of land in the Danube River, 170 00:12:55,660 --> 00:12:57,580 unclaimed by neighbouring Serbia 171 00:12:57,580 --> 00:13:00,620 nor Croatia, he spotted an opportunity. 172 00:13:00,620 --> 00:13:02,580 Thus, Liberland was born. 173 00:13:07,420 --> 00:13:10,300 But as that island still has no roads 174 00:13:10,300 --> 00:13:13,500 or electricity, for the time being 175 00:13:13,500 --> 00:13:16,620 the founding fathers of Liberland have set up an outpost 176 00:13:16,620 --> 00:13:19,220 called Ark Village just across the river. 177 00:13:25,060 --> 00:13:27,740 So we're all in here, yeah? - We're all in here. 178 00:13:29,420 --> 00:13:31,340 - I guess it takes a while to build 179 00:13:31,340 --> 00:13:37,100 one of these communities into a billionaire-suitable... 180 00:13:37,100 --> 00:13:38,540 ..community. 181 00:13:38,540 --> 00:13:39,820 Nice. 182 00:13:52,660 --> 00:13:55,060 Morning. 183 00:13:55,060 --> 00:13:56,620 HE LAUGHS 184 00:13:56,620 --> 00:13:59,660 Free country, isn't it? - Yeah. 185 00:13:59,660 --> 00:14:02,140 - I'm looking for your president. Is he around? 186 00:14:02,140 --> 00:14:04,340 - Yes. I will bring you to the president. 187 00:14:04,340 --> 00:14:06,900 He's upstairs. We're waiting for you for breakfast. 188 00:14:06,900 --> 00:14:10,220 Come in. Welcome... - Thank you. - ..to the Ark. 189 00:14:10,220 --> 00:14:11,460 - Right. Yes. 190 00:14:11,460 --> 00:14:14,180 - Good morning. - Hello, Mr President. Matt. 191 00:14:14,180 --> 00:14:16,740 - Nice meeting you, Matt. How are you doing? - Good, good. 192 00:14:16,740 --> 00:14:18,860 Thanks so much for having me. - Yes, please. 193 00:14:18,860 --> 00:14:20,780 Please join us for breakfast, guys. - Great. 194 00:14:23,340 --> 00:14:24,900 - Yeah, we'll actually show you around 195 00:14:24,900 --> 00:14:27,700 the plots that we bought around this property 196 00:14:27,700 --> 00:14:30,140 where we want to build longevity clinic and spa. 197 00:14:30,140 --> 00:14:32,980 I think longevity tourism in general will be 198 00:14:32,980 --> 00:14:37,460 one of the key businesses, not just cryptocurrencies, 199 00:14:37,460 --> 00:14:40,380 not just AI, which we already have quite a lot. 200 00:14:40,380 --> 00:14:42,780 - How many companies generally are registered? 201 00:14:42,780 --> 00:14:45,100 - I think we've got 200 active companies right now. 202 00:14:45,100 --> 00:14:47,100 - Really? Registered in Liberland? Wow. 203 00:14:47,100 --> 00:14:48,980 And is this your son here? Hello. 204 00:14:50,140 --> 00:14:53,060 Are you a citizen of Liberland yourself? 205 00:14:53,060 --> 00:14:55,260 - Uh... - No. Czechia? 206 00:14:55,260 --> 00:14:57,020 THEY LAUGH 207 00:14:57,020 --> 00:14:58,940 - He's got his passport, of course. 208 00:14:58,940 --> 00:15:01,380 - Oh, nice. A Liberland passport? - Yeah. - Cool. 209 00:15:20,500 --> 00:15:23,180 - We had special deal that they will not intervene 210 00:15:23,180 --> 00:15:25,380 in our conversations and you are still unable... 211 00:15:25,380 --> 00:15:26,780 But I made the deal with you 212 00:15:26,780 --> 00:15:28,540 that you will not intervene in the interview, 213 00:15:28,540 --> 00:15:30,180 and that's the first thing you have to do. 214 00:15:30,180 --> 00:15:33,100 And you cannot help yourself. Right? If you could just leave completely, 215 00:15:33,100 --> 00:15:34,940 I would really appreciate it. 216 00:15:34,940 --> 00:15:36,460 Yes, yes, yes. 217 00:15:37,780 --> 00:15:39,260 - Thank you. - You're welcome. 218 00:15:41,740 --> 00:15:46,020 - This is actually Ark, like, the main base of Liberland 219 00:15:46,020 --> 00:15:47,780 for now in the region. 220 00:15:47,780 --> 00:15:51,460 - Oh, nice. I didn't see any of this because I arrived late in the night. 221 00:15:52,580 --> 00:15:56,140 In most modern democracies, everyone has an equal vote. 222 00:15:56,140 --> 00:15:58,580 But things are different in Liberland, 223 00:15:58,580 --> 00:16:02,140 thanks to a crypto token called Liberland merits. 224 00:16:03,460 --> 00:16:06,140 - The elections are every three months. They're taking place on 225 00:16:06,140 --> 00:16:09,980 blockchain and the person is elected with merits. 226 00:16:09,980 --> 00:16:14,140 So the people that have more merits are able to have more say 227 00:16:14,140 --> 00:16:16,620 in who is going to be in the leadership of the country. 228 00:16:16,620 --> 00:16:19,340 - And can you purchase Liberland merit? 229 00:16:19,340 --> 00:16:22,780 - Yes, yes. - This sort of system does allow people 230 00:16:22,780 --> 00:16:25,300 with more money to have more power, essentially, 231 00:16:25,300 --> 00:16:27,220 and pay less tax. 232 00:16:27,220 --> 00:16:29,620 - You don't pay taxes in Liberland. They are voluntary. 233 00:16:29,620 --> 00:16:33,820 This will no longer be Liberland if we start taking people's money. 234 00:16:33,820 --> 00:16:37,300 Maybe we can actually make a photo in front of the house together. 235 00:16:37,300 --> 00:16:38,580 Nice gathering. 236 00:16:39,900 --> 00:16:41,620 Let's go, let's go, let's go, let's go. 237 00:16:41,620 --> 00:16:44,020 Let's make some 3D scans. 238 00:16:52,260 --> 00:16:54,620 - So will we be able to visit Liberland? 239 00:16:54,620 --> 00:16:57,980 - There's conditions for visiting Liberland from Croatian side. 240 00:16:57,980 --> 00:17:00,900 Because I've got this five-year ban from Croatia. 241 00:17:00,900 --> 00:17:03,700 - And what's that for? - That's for building Liberland. 242 00:17:05,220 --> 00:17:07,660 - The problem with starting a tiny new country is that 243 00:17:07,660 --> 00:17:10,540 you sometimes have to contend with proper countries, 244 00:17:10,540 --> 00:17:12,700 ones with armies and police forces. 245 00:17:14,180 --> 00:17:16,100 Vit and the other Liberlanders have 246 00:17:16,100 --> 00:17:17,700 regularly been apprehended by 247 00:17:17,700 --> 00:17:20,660 the Croatian authorities while trying to visit the island. 248 00:17:22,220 --> 00:17:25,500 - Don't touch myself. Don't touch me! Don't touch me. 249 00:17:25,500 --> 00:17:27,380 - INDISTINCT SHOUTING 250 00:17:32,060 --> 00:17:33,780 At the moment, the only option 251 00:17:33,780 --> 00:17:36,940 for visitors like me is to see the island by boat. 252 00:17:44,020 --> 00:17:49,300 - Today, we're going to embark on a voyage across many borders. 253 00:17:49,300 --> 00:17:52,820 Serbia, Croatia, Liberland. 254 00:17:52,820 --> 00:17:54,260 It fills me with such pride 255 00:17:54,260 --> 00:17:56,900 every time my eyes gaze upon our land. 256 00:17:57,980 --> 00:17:59,860 Here we see Liberty Island. 257 00:17:59,860 --> 00:18:03,140 And it's great to know we have settlers there right now. 258 00:18:03,140 --> 00:18:04,540 They're braving the elements 259 00:18:04,540 --> 00:18:09,340 and putting up with constant checks by the Croatian police. 260 00:18:09,340 --> 00:18:13,620 - Yeah. - But they still maintain a presence there. 261 00:18:13,620 --> 00:18:17,540 And we really have to respect and admire their courage. 262 00:18:17,540 --> 00:18:19,140 It's an inspiration to us all. 263 00:18:21,300 --> 00:18:24,940 On the day the border opened, August 6th, 2023, 264 00:18:24,940 --> 00:18:26,660 I spent eight days in Liberland, 265 00:18:26,660 --> 00:18:28,460 and that was a dream come true. 266 00:18:28,460 --> 00:18:31,420 The moment I stepped over that imaginary line 267 00:18:31,420 --> 00:18:34,180 in the road leading into Liberland, it was just magic. 268 00:18:35,620 --> 00:18:38,060 - Great. - There's our people right there. 269 00:18:38,060 --> 00:18:40,700 - Wow. So these are the permanent settlers of Liberland down there? 270 00:18:44,940 --> 00:18:48,180 Martin's like your whole kind of government right now, really. 271 00:18:48,180 --> 00:18:50,380 - Yes. He is holding the fort. 272 00:18:50,380 --> 00:18:51,900 Hey, Martin, we have to decorate you. 273 00:18:51,900 --> 00:18:54,500 We have two people to decorate today. 274 00:18:54,500 --> 00:18:56,820 Martin, we appreciate your involvement very much. 275 00:18:56,820 --> 00:18:58,980 I will hand it over to you during the Christmas party, 276 00:18:58,980 --> 00:19:01,380 during the constitutional convention, 277 00:19:01,380 --> 00:19:04,300 but it's here for you for the bravery. 278 00:19:04,300 --> 00:19:05,860 - CHEERING AND APPLAUSE 279 00:19:08,740 --> 00:19:11,700 - This is for you and for your... How many years now? 280 00:19:11,700 --> 00:19:13,620 - Three. - ..three years 281 00:19:13,620 --> 00:19:16,780 very good service taking care of this ship. 282 00:19:16,780 --> 00:19:20,300 We appreciate your commitment to building... 283 00:19:20,300 --> 00:19:22,420 ..building the freest country on the planet. 284 00:19:22,420 --> 00:19:25,100 - Thank you, Mr President. - Let's have some drinks downstairs. 285 00:19:25,100 --> 00:19:27,060 Let's celebrate that little bit. And... 286 00:19:31,940 --> 00:19:34,060 - Lib, lib, lib. - Lib, lib, lib. 287 00:19:34,060 --> 00:19:35,900 - Lib, lib, lib. 288 00:19:35,900 --> 00:19:38,140 Lib, lib, lib to the First Lady. 289 00:19:38,140 --> 00:19:41,900 - Croatian presents. It has become really good, this VR. Like, really 290 00:19:41,900 --> 00:19:45,220 like, feeling... Streaming from Liberland Wi-Fi. 291 00:19:45,220 --> 00:19:47,060 - Is this what Liberland is going to look like? 292 00:19:47,060 --> 00:19:48,980 Oh, my God. 293 00:19:48,980 --> 00:19:55,540 I see towering, gleaming skyscrapers with floating public parks. 294 00:19:55,540 --> 00:19:58,860 I see waterfalls, I see mountains. 295 00:19:58,860 --> 00:20:00,660 You're going to struggle with that one, I think. 296 00:20:00,660 --> 00:20:04,100 Yeah. I think this is going to be pretty expensive, guys. 297 00:20:04,100 --> 00:20:05,620 - Our prime minister, Justin Sun, 298 00:20:05,620 --> 00:20:08,220 could easily contribute $100 million. 299 00:20:08,220 --> 00:20:12,020 He wouldn't mind because it's like one week of his personal income, 300 00:20:12,020 --> 00:20:13,900 the current... - Right. - ..fees. 301 00:20:15,460 --> 00:20:17,340 - With their new wealthy backers, 302 00:20:17,340 --> 00:20:21,300 Liberland may now actually have the money to start building, 303 00:20:21,300 --> 00:20:25,820 but to become officially recognised, they'll also need political support. 304 00:20:25,820 --> 00:20:29,220 - I see some opportunities for us. There are some people 305 00:20:29,220 --> 00:20:32,860 in the current administration that are friendly towards Liberland. 306 00:20:32,860 --> 00:20:34,740 - Like who in particular? - I would say, um, 307 00:20:34,740 --> 00:20:37,460 Director of National Intelligence Tulsi Gabbard. 308 00:20:37,460 --> 00:20:40,220 US ambassador to the United Nations Mike Waltz - 309 00:20:40,220 --> 00:20:41,500 we've met with him. 310 00:20:41,500 --> 00:20:44,500 - Everything in Liberland is managed through this platform. 311 00:20:44,500 --> 00:20:46,100 - But Liberland's best chance 312 00:20:46,100 --> 00:20:48,020 of getting support from the White House 313 00:20:48,020 --> 00:20:51,460 may be through their new prime minister, Justin Sun, 314 00:20:51,460 --> 00:20:55,620 who's the main investor in the Trump family crypto business. 315 00:20:55,620 --> 00:20:59,860 - Justin Sun, by far, is now the most popular in the system. 316 00:21:03,820 --> 00:21:07,180 - But not all Liberlanders seem enthused with Justin Sun. 317 00:21:10,260 --> 00:21:14,500 Dave, who keeps calling himself the Prince of Liberland, 318 00:21:14,500 --> 00:21:17,780 has told me off camera that he isn't too keen on the guy, 319 00:21:17,780 --> 00:21:20,980 but Vit keeps telling him not to speak to me about it. 320 00:21:38,100 --> 00:21:42,420 - OK. I'm set. - All right. - I'm an architect from Switzerland. 321 00:21:42,420 --> 00:21:45,180 I am following this project since ten years. 322 00:21:45,180 --> 00:21:48,460 I do the, you know, the survey work with the drones. 323 00:21:48,460 --> 00:21:51,380 - And what's in your back pocket? "University of Liberland 324 00:21:51,380 --> 00:21:54,020 "Adventure Centre, founded by Prince David of Lib..." 325 00:21:54,020 --> 00:21:56,380 Are you the Prince of Liberland, then? 326 00:21:56,380 --> 00:21:57,660 - People say I am. 327 00:21:57,660 --> 00:21:59,940 Do you know any other Prince of Liberland? 328 00:21:59,940 --> 00:22:02,220 - No. You're the first one. - Yes, because it's me. 329 00:22:02,220 --> 00:22:04,420 - THEY LAUGH 330 00:22:04,420 --> 00:22:06,620 I've noticed Vit. He gets annoyed at you 331 00:22:06,620 --> 00:22:10,580 when you speak about the prime minister, Justin Sun. 332 00:22:10,580 --> 00:22:12,540 - Not everybody has to agree with 333 00:22:12,540 --> 00:22:14,740 the president, like any other country. 334 00:22:14,740 --> 00:22:17,300 - What was it specifically that he was annoyed with? 335 00:22:17,300 --> 00:22:19,380 - You know, it's a small country. 336 00:22:19,380 --> 00:22:23,300 So if people just say whatever they want to the BBC... 337 00:22:24,420 --> 00:22:26,340 ..it gets out there. And... - Is this something 338 00:22:26,340 --> 00:22:28,220 that you're not comfortable talking about? 339 00:22:28,220 --> 00:22:30,460 - No. I mean, I'm comfortable to talk about, 340 00:22:30,460 --> 00:22:34,860 but, you know, money rules the world, like everywhere. 341 00:22:34,860 --> 00:22:37,260 And, yeah, sometimes... 342 00:22:39,420 --> 00:22:41,460 ..not all the money is the best money. 343 00:22:45,820 --> 00:22:49,660 - Dave may not think Justin Sun's money is good money, 344 00:22:49,660 --> 00:22:52,860 and therefore disagree with him being prime minister, 345 00:22:52,860 --> 00:22:54,700 but there's not much he can do about it. 346 00:22:55,900 --> 00:22:59,740 Dave has less money than Liberland's billionaire citizens, 347 00:22:59,740 --> 00:23:02,260 which means fewer Liberland merits, 348 00:23:02,260 --> 00:23:05,300 which means his opinion is worth less. 349 00:23:06,860 --> 00:23:10,180 Does this show the perils of replacing democracy 350 00:23:10,180 --> 00:23:11,660 with governance tokens 351 00:23:11,660 --> 00:23:13,540 that can be bought on the blockchain? 352 00:23:14,860 --> 00:23:18,140 Is Liberland really about liberty for everyone, 353 00:23:18,140 --> 00:23:21,060 or just people who are really, really rich? 354 00:23:21,060 --> 00:23:24,940 To find out, I'm speaking with Liberland's interior minister, 355 00:23:24,940 --> 00:23:28,740 who has just invited me for a ride in his brand-new Mercedes. 356 00:23:35,660 --> 00:23:36,900 Why does he love it so much? 357 00:23:37,900 --> 00:23:39,220 OK. 358 00:23:42,620 --> 00:23:44,740 - Yep. - And how does he get them in? - Oh. 359 00:23:52,380 --> 00:23:55,020 - Ivan Pernar started his political career 360 00:23:55,020 --> 00:23:58,900 as a controversial Croatian MP who was notoriously kicked out 361 00:23:58,900 --> 00:24:02,060 of parliament for spreading conspiracy theories. 362 00:24:02,060 --> 00:24:03,940 SHOUTING 363 00:24:05,660 --> 00:24:09,220 Upon leaving, he met Vit, and shortly after 364 00:24:09,220 --> 00:24:13,060 became interior minister of Liberland. 365 00:24:13,060 --> 00:24:17,340 - My job is to ensure your freedom - freedom of choice, 366 00:24:17,340 --> 00:24:20,140 freedom of speech, freedom to say what you believe. 367 00:24:22,500 --> 00:24:25,380 Liberland is a project 368 00:24:25,380 --> 00:24:30,260 which attracts people on ideological level. 369 00:24:30,260 --> 00:24:33,340 Usually people who believe in freedom, 370 00:24:33,340 --> 00:24:35,780 decentralised finances, and so on, 371 00:24:35,780 --> 00:24:39,700 they tend to be from the upper class of society. 372 00:24:39,700 --> 00:24:41,740 - That is a certain new elite, isn't it? 373 00:24:41,740 --> 00:24:44,380 - Yes. For example, this is Philippe Patek watch, 374 00:24:44,380 --> 00:24:47,380 for example. - OK. Congratulations. - Nice rose gold model. 375 00:24:47,380 --> 00:24:48,660 You know? 376 00:24:48,660 --> 00:24:52,340 In England there are high taxes on such luxury items. 377 00:24:52,340 --> 00:24:53,700 This is one of the things 378 00:24:53,700 --> 00:24:56,220 why people would like to join this project. 379 00:24:56,220 --> 00:24:58,460 - But only people who you allow to join the project. 380 00:24:58,460 --> 00:25:01,060 - Yes. If you make zero selection 381 00:25:01,060 --> 00:25:03,420 and you say whoever comes on boat 382 00:25:03,420 --> 00:25:05,620 is welcome, we would end up like UK. 383 00:25:05,620 --> 00:25:07,020 We don't want that. 384 00:25:07,020 --> 00:25:09,380 - So you get to decide who joins... - Who on board. 385 00:25:09,380 --> 00:25:11,620 - ..who comes into the castle, basically. 386 00:25:11,620 --> 00:25:14,580 - Yes, but you have to be picky. 387 00:25:14,580 --> 00:25:15,980 - So it's liberty, but... 388 00:25:17,220 --> 00:25:18,420 - For a selected few. 389 00:25:18,420 --> 00:25:20,620 - ..some people have more liberty than others. 390 00:25:20,620 --> 00:25:23,860 - Yes. - Because it does strike me that one of the main merits 391 00:25:23,860 --> 00:25:25,060 that allows you to have power 392 00:25:25,060 --> 00:25:26,900 and influence within Liberland is money, right? 393 00:25:26,900 --> 00:25:29,020 - Of course, of course, of course. - Right. Of course. 394 00:25:29,020 --> 00:25:32,700 - If you leave a bunch of bums in your country 395 00:25:32,700 --> 00:25:35,820 without anything and who just demand something, 396 00:25:35,820 --> 00:25:38,380 then, on the other hand, somebody's got to pay for that. 397 00:25:38,380 --> 00:25:42,620 - Could taxation as a redistribution of wealth be seen 398 00:25:42,620 --> 00:25:44,220 as a way to give more freedom to people, 399 00:25:44,220 --> 00:25:46,140 to give more liberty to people? 400 00:25:46,140 --> 00:25:47,980 - No, because, um... 401 00:25:47,980 --> 00:25:53,540 There was some story about a wildlife reserve in America. 402 00:25:53,540 --> 00:25:55,540 There are animals there and it's written, 403 00:25:55,540 --> 00:25:58,860 "Don't feed the animals," because if you do, 404 00:25:58,860 --> 00:26:01,060 they will be accustomed to that 405 00:26:01,060 --> 00:26:04,900 and they will lose the ability to feed themselves... 406 00:26:04,900 --> 00:26:08,980 - Right. - ..to find the way. And the same is with people. 407 00:26:08,980 --> 00:26:11,180 - You like liberty, right? That's the whole thing. 408 00:26:11,180 --> 00:26:13,060 - Yes. Economic liberty. - Yes. OK. 409 00:26:13,060 --> 00:26:16,860 Well, the system that you are describing denies more 410 00:26:16,860 --> 00:26:18,500 people economic liberty than 411 00:26:18,500 --> 00:26:21,460 the system that exists in most Western nations today. 412 00:26:21,460 --> 00:26:25,260 - If that is your opinion, you can have it, 413 00:26:25,260 --> 00:26:26,780 although I would disagree. 414 00:26:26,780 --> 00:26:29,340 - Is liberty just for the wealthy? You know, 415 00:26:29,340 --> 00:26:32,380 is that really a just way to run society? 416 00:26:32,380 --> 00:26:33,420 - Look... 417 00:26:35,060 --> 00:26:36,340 ..that's a very tricky question. 418 00:26:36,340 --> 00:26:38,820 - It's a very limited amount of liberty to go around. 419 00:26:38,820 --> 00:26:41,020 - No, no, no. Now you've got me in a situation 420 00:26:41,020 --> 00:26:42,940 where I have a hard time to answer. 421 00:26:42,940 --> 00:26:44,940 But I would say correctly, 422 00:26:44,940 --> 00:26:49,940 only people who have economic freedom can indeed be free. 423 00:26:57,300 --> 00:26:59,700 - Literally, the criticisms 424 00:26:59,700 --> 00:27:02,020 that most people have of democracies, 425 00:27:02,020 --> 00:27:04,980 that wealthy people have too much power 426 00:27:04,980 --> 00:27:07,780 and that other people have less political power, 427 00:27:07,780 --> 00:27:13,460 that inequality is actually written into the constitution of Liberland. 428 00:27:13,460 --> 00:27:15,660 It might seem like a group of travellers 429 00:27:15,660 --> 00:27:19,820 with a few tents in a flood plain in the middle of the Danube River, 430 00:27:19,820 --> 00:27:23,020 but the fact that it's tied to 30 billionaires means that 431 00:27:23,020 --> 00:27:27,780 this is actually a future that some of the most 432 00:27:27,780 --> 00:27:30,300 powerful people in the world envision for all of us. 433 00:27:37,060 --> 00:27:38,380 Around the world, 434 00:27:38,380 --> 00:27:39,820 new blockchain nations, 435 00:27:39,820 --> 00:27:41,100 just like Liberland, 436 00:27:41,100 --> 00:27:44,940 promise to eradicate taxes and government regulation. 437 00:27:44,940 --> 00:27:46,860 From Prospera in Honduras, 438 00:27:46,860 --> 00:27:49,900 to Peter Thiel's Seasteading Institute, 439 00:27:49,900 --> 00:27:53,380 what drives these projects is a wall of cash 440 00:27:53,380 --> 00:27:57,140 in the form of billionaire investors and venture capitalists, 441 00:27:57,140 --> 00:28:00,700 emanating almost entirely from one place - 442 00:28:00,700 --> 00:28:02,380 Silicon Valley. 443 00:28:10,900 --> 00:28:14,340 NEWSREADER: - A phone, an iPod, and an internet browser. 444 00:28:14,340 --> 00:28:16,700 - We've all gotten used to the idea that products 445 00:28:16,700 --> 00:28:19,740 from Silicon Valley have changed the world, 446 00:28:19,740 --> 00:28:23,300 but we're still getting used to quite how rich and powerful 447 00:28:23,300 --> 00:28:26,220 the tech billionaires behind those products now are. 448 00:28:26,220 --> 00:28:28,060 - # Money talks 449 00:28:28,060 --> 00:28:29,340 # Money talks... # 450 00:28:29,340 --> 00:28:31,900 - They're no longer just interested in profit, 451 00:28:31,900 --> 00:28:36,260 they also want to rewrite how society is governed. 452 00:28:36,260 --> 00:28:40,180 At some point, this new elite began to see crypto 453 00:28:40,180 --> 00:28:43,580 and blockchain technology as the solution. 454 00:28:43,580 --> 00:28:46,580 - Bitcoin is going to completely transform the economy. 455 00:28:46,580 --> 00:28:48,900 AI is going to take all our jobs. 456 00:28:48,900 --> 00:28:51,620 Stem cells are going to make us live forever. 457 00:28:51,620 --> 00:28:55,620 - Um, that's a lot to contemplate all at one time. 458 00:28:55,620 --> 00:28:59,540 - Tim Draper is a billionaire venture capitalist and libertarian 459 00:28:59,540 --> 00:29:02,420 known for early investments in companies like Tesla, 460 00:29:02,420 --> 00:29:04,300 SpaceX, and Skype 461 00:29:04,300 --> 00:29:07,940 and for being really, really into Bitcoin. 462 00:29:07,940 --> 00:29:11,500 - People have asked me, "Well, when are you going to sell your Bitcoin?" 463 00:29:11,500 --> 00:29:13,460 And I say, "Into what?!" 464 00:29:13,460 --> 00:29:16,300 - He's also an investor in Prospera 465 00:29:16,300 --> 00:29:18,580 and is creating his own digital country, 466 00:29:18,580 --> 00:29:22,260 Draper Nation, with Bitcoin as the national currency. 467 00:29:22,260 --> 00:29:25,580 - Welcome to... - ALL: - Draper Nation... 468 00:29:25,580 --> 00:29:29,060 - ..the first-ever completely digital country. 469 00:29:29,060 --> 00:29:32,020 Instead of cash, you have digital money. 470 00:29:33,220 --> 00:29:36,500 - But his main focus is Draper University. 471 00:29:36,500 --> 00:29:38,940 Half university, half Dragons' Den, 472 00:29:38,940 --> 00:29:41,940 Draper U trains aspiring tech founders, 473 00:29:41,940 --> 00:29:45,020 while having them compete for Draper's investment. 474 00:29:46,020 --> 00:29:48,580 THEY SHOUT AND CHEER 475 00:29:48,580 --> 00:29:52,660 Tech founders are taught here that they are real-life superheroes 476 00:29:52,660 --> 00:29:57,580 and have the power to reshape society according to their genius. 477 00:29:57,580 --> 00:29:59,420 I've been invited to the ceremony 478 00:29:59,420 --> 00:30:03,860 where soon-to-be graduates ascend to that superhero status. 479 00:30:03,860 --> 00:30:07,900 It might be hard, especially for the English brain, 480 00:30:07,900 --> 00:30:11,060 to wrap their head around what's going on here. 481 00:30:11,060 --> 00:30:15,860 But this isn't just a kind of silly superhero graduation ceremony. 482 00:30:15,860 --> 00:30:17,140 Seven of these people 483 00:30:17,140 --> 00:30:22,020 will be getting $100,000 from Tim Draper's venture capital fund. 484 00:30:24,620 --> 00:30:27,900 CHANTING: - Jump! Jump! Jump! 485 00:30:29,060 --> 00:30:30,900 - THEY CHEER 486 00:30:32,020 --> 00:30:36,420 Justin Sun himself was once a student of Draper University. 487 00:30:36,420 --> 00:30:38,900 I want to find out what it is about this place 488 00:30:38,900 --> 00:30:40,260 that may have led him to think 489 00:30:40,260 --> 00:30:44,500 he was a superhero with the power to reshape finance and politics. 490 00:30:50,700 --> 00:30:53,060 Matt. Good to meet you. - Arisa. Nice to meet you. 491 00:30:53,060 --> 00:30:54,580 - Thanks for having us. - Yeah. 492 00:30:54,580 --> 00:30:58,860 Thank you for coming. - Wow! OK, so the first thing I'm noticing is, 493 00:30:58,860 --> 00:31:00,500 is that a Tesla? - Yeah. 494 00:31:00,500 --> 00:31:03,060 Elon Musk, a long time ago, that he gifted us. 495 00:31:03,060 --> 00:31:04,420 And then... 496 00:31:04,420 --> 00:31:07,460 But Tim Draper didn't want to use as a car. 497 00:31:07,460 --> 00:31:10,300 - Wait, sorry. Elon Musk gave you this Tesla 498 00:31:10,300 --> 00:31:12,100 and you decided to cut it up and use it... 499 00:31:12,100 --> 00:31:15,460 - Yeah. - ..as a reception desk? - Yeah. - Oh, my God! 500 00:31:15,460 --> 00:31:19,940 - So this is called Hero City. And every one of the founders, 501 00:31:19,940 --> 00:31:22,260 we consider that everyone is a superhero. 502 00:31:22,260 --> 00:31:23,740 They're creating the new things. 503 00:31:23,740 --> 00:31:27,940 Everyone is like really making something impossible possible. 504 00:31:27,940 --> 00:31:30,900 - So, that's Tim over there. 505 00:31:30,900 --> 00:31:34,980 And what's that thing? - I am Tim Draper. 506 00:31:34,980 --> 00:31:37,060 This may look and sound like me, 507 00:31:37,060 --> 00:31:40,980 but this is actually a holographic AI persona. - Wow. Impressive. 508 00:31:40,980 --> 00:31:43,020 - He wears the Bitcoin tie and Bitcoin socks. 509 00:31:43,020 --> 00:31:45,940 - Yeah, he loves the Bitcoin tie and socks, doesn't he? Yeah. 510 00:31:45,940 --> 00:31:48,380 - Yeah. So from upstairs every 511 00:31:48,380 --> 00:31:51,700 entire rooms will be the founders' room. 512 00:31:51,700 --> 00:31:57,140 And these are the 101 stuff that they want to do before they die. 513 00:31:57,140 --> 00:32:01,260 - "Fly first class." "Snowboard down a real mountain." 514 00:32:01,260 --> 00:32:05,260 It's quite sweet. "Own a cow till it dies naturally." 515 00:32:05,260 --> 00:32:08,060 We've all been there. We've all had that desire. 516 00:32:09,660 --> 00:32:12,020 How is Tim Draper trying to mould 517 00:32:12,020 --> 00:32:14,740 the coming generation of tech elites? 518 00:32:14,740 --> 00:32:17,660 Time to meet my next billionaire. Hello. 519 00:32:17,660 --> 00:32:19,620 - Hi. How are you? - Good. - Hi. 520 00:32:19,620 --> 00:32:22,540 Tim Draper. Nice to see you. - Thanks very much for having us. 521 00:32:22,540 --> 00:32:26,020 - Great. Happy to have you here. - Around ten years ago, 522 00:32:26,020 --> 00:32:29,060 the view of Silicon Valley and of the tech industry was 523 00:32:29,060 --> 00:32:31,260 so positive and exciting. 524 00:32:31,260 --> 00:32:32,500 Recently, it's... 525 00:32:32,500 --> 00:32:36,180 That perception for some people has almost, like, flipped, 526 00:32:36,180 --> 00:32:38,980 and they see Silicon Valley as almost evil, 527 00:32:38,980 --> 00:32:40,660 like it has some kind of sinister intent. 528 00:32:40,660 --> 00:32:44,940 - You know, I think what happens is entrepreneurs, 529 00:32:44,940 --> 00:32:49,180 they go out to transform the world. 530 00:32:49,180 --> 00:32:53,940 And as they struggle, people are sort of cheering them on. 531 00:32:53,940 --> 00:32:58,540 But when they become successful, there's this weird backlash. 532 00:32:58,540 --> 00:33:01,500 All of a sudden, it's like, "Wait, why is that? 533 00:33:01,500 --> 00:33:05,660 "Why does Jeff Bezos have $300 billion and I don't?" 534 00:33:05,660 --> 00:33:10,820 Well, look what he's done for you! I thank him every day. 535 00:33:10,820 --> 00:33:12,620 I, if I need a toothbrush, 536 00:33:12,620 --> 00:33:15,740 I can get it in four hours just by... 537 00:33:15,740 --> 00:33:20,540 And it's off. - Right. - And this attitude, that is the Silicon Valley 538 00:33:20,540 --> 00:33:23,900 of, let's just do it better than the guy before, 539 00:33:23,900 --> 00:33:27,380 that attitude is important. - I think we're now at a stage 540 00:33:27,380 --> 00:33:29,380 where those ideas are expanding into, 541 00:33:29,380 --> 00:33:31,140 you know, ideas like government 542 00:33:31,140 --> 00:33:33,060 and how we run our society as a whole. 543 00:33:33,060 --> 00:33:35,140 Maybe that's part of the perception 544 00:33:35,140 --> 00:33:37,340 that now they're kind of coming for politics, 545 00:33:37,340 --> 00:33:38,420 you know, kind of thing. 546 00:33:38,420 --> 00:33:41,300 - Government is providing bad service at a high cost. 547 00:33:41,300 --> 00:33:45,980 Now we do have new technology. We have...we have Bitcoin, 548 00:33:45,980 --> 00:33:48,500 we have the blockchain, we have smart contracts, 549 00:33:48,500 --> 00:33:51,780 and now we have these decentralised, autonomous organisations... 550 00:33:51,780 --> 00:33:54,020 - Could that replace government and banking? 551 00:33:54,020 --> 00:33:57,140 - Absolutely. Well, I mean, that's what's happening. - Right. 552 00:33:57,140 --> 00:33:58,780 - It's just a matter of time. 553 00:33:58,780 --> 00:34:03,260 Anyway, so, I created Draper University of Heroes. 554 00:34:03,260 --> 00:34:06,220 Our thinking was, the world needs more heroes. 555 00:34:06,220 --> 00:34:09,820 Let's make heroes. In a very weird way, 556 00:34:09,820 --> 00:34:12,500 my friend said, "Hey, you're starting a school. 557 00:34:12,500 --> 00:34:16,700 "You've got to have a pledge." And it came to me sort of on a flow. 558 00:34:16,700 --> 00:34:20,340 It took me three and a half minutes. Wow. 559 00:34:20,340 --> 00:34:21,860 - By the time they graduate, 560 00:34:21,860 --> 00:34:25,460 Draper U students are expected to memorise this pledge. 561 00:34:26,500 --> 00:34:29,700 - I will promote freedom at all costs. 562 00:34:29,700 --> 00:34:32,460 - STUDENTS: - I will promote freedom at all costs. 563 00:34:32,460 --> 00:34:34,500 - On the final day of the ceremony, 564 00:34:34,500 --> 00:34:36,420 they recite it before pitching 565 00:34:36,420 --> 00:34:39,340 their business ideas to a panel of investors. 566 00:34:39,340 --> 00:34:42,420 - I will do everything in my power to drive, build 567 00:34:42,420 --> 00:34:44,460 and pursue progress and change. 568 00:34:44,460 --> 00:34:51,940 - I will try my best to make reparations for my digressions. 569 00:34:51,940 --> 00:34:53,940 - WHISPERING: It's a tad culty, that last bit. 570 00:34:53,940 --> 00:35:01,900 - I will explore the world with gusto and enthusiasm! 571 00:35:01,900 --> 00:35:05,540 - OK, here we go. One, two... 572 00:35:05,540 --> 00:35:07,900 - This isn't like a normal day out for a venture capitalist. 573 00:35:07,900 --> 00:35:09,660 - No. - No. 574 00:35:11,100 --> 00:35:16,060 - One, two, three, four, five, six... 575 00:35:16,060 --> 00:35:19,260 - Draper U isn't just about building entrepreneurs. 576 00:35:19,260 --> 00:35:23,260 It's also about making sure that the next generation of tech elites 577 00:35:23,260 --> 00:35:25,460 share his libertarian world-view. 578 00:35:53,020 --> 00:35:56,220 Jeff Frazee is one of the venture capitalists invited 579 00:35:56,220 --> 00:35:59,660 to consider investment in Draper U's outgoing class. 580 00:35:59,660 --> 00:36:04,060 He's also the founder and CEO of Young Americans For Liberty, 581 00:36:04,060 --> 00:36:07,100 whose chapters are known for inviting controversial figures, 582 00:36:07,100 --> 00:36:10,060 including the white nationalist Nick Fuentes, 583 00:36:10,060 --> 00:36:12,180 to speak at university campuses. 584 00:36:13,300 --> 00:36:15,180 What is Young Americans For Liberty 585 00:36:15,180 --> 00:36:17,460 and what's its connection to Draper University? 586 00:36:17,460 --> 00:36:20,060 - Yeah, so I'm founder and CEO of Young Americans For Liberty. 587 00:36:20,060 --> 00:36:22,180 We are actively on 400 college campuses 588 00:36:22,180 --> 00:36:24,980 spreading the word of liberty, getting young people involved 589 00:36:24,980 --> 00:36:27,340 to take action and influence political process. 590 00:36:27,340 --> 00:36:30,260 Tim has been a big supporter of ours for a number of years 591 00:36:30,260 --> 00:36:33,180 and his beliefs align with our beliefs. 592 00:36:33,180 --> 00:36:36,060 - Technology is now getting to the point where some people are saying 593 00:36:36,060 --> 00:36:37,820 it could actually have the functionality 594 00:36:37,820 --> 00:36:40,180 to replace government almost entirely. 595 00:36:40,180 --> 00:36:42,220 Is that something that you think we will see happen? 596 00:36:42,220 --> 00:36:44,700 - Yes. I believe technology is the key to success 597 00:36:44,700 --> 00:36:47,620 and we've got to be able to allow for entrepreneurs 598 00:36:47,620 --> 00:36:50,700 and innovators to be able to have the freedom to explore 599 00:36:50,700 --> 00:36:52,820 and to find the solution to big ideas. 600 00:36:52,820 --> 00:36:55,420 Governance is not a solution. Governance is in the way. 601 00:36:55,420 --> 00:36:58,300 And this is where I think society is evolving to - 602 00:36:58,300 --> 00:37:00,780 people being able to have the choice to be able to move 603 00:37:00,780 --> 00:37:03,140 and to choose what rule of law they want to live under. 604 00:37:03,140 --> 00:37:05,540 And the more we can move towards a more decentralised form 605 00:37:05,540 --> 00:37:08,220 of governance, I think society will flourish. 606 00:37:08,220 --> 00:37:09,500 - How would taxing work? 607 00:37:10,500 --> 00:37:12,540 - Well, I'd hope it'd be minimal to none. 608 00:37:12,540 --> 00:37:15,780 Taxation, all it is is... Taxation is theft. 609 00:37:15,780 --> 00:37:18,700 It's being able to take money from you at the barrel of a gun. 610 00:37:18,700 --> 00:37:22,140 - Isn't this just an excuse to kind of say, 611 00:37:22,140 --> 00:37:24,300 "I want to keep my wealth and get richer"? 612 00:37:24,300 --> 00:37:26,700 - Absolutely. Fantastic. The only way you get richer 613 00:37:26,700 --> 00:37:29,100 in a free society is you're providing value to others. 614 00:37:29,100 --> 00:37:31,060 And so I think we should be applauding capitalists. 615 00:37:31,060 --> 00:37:33,500 We should be applauding people who are wealthy. 616 00:37:36,300 --> 00:37:39,100 - Draper sees Silicon Valley's tech entrepreneurs 617 00:37:39,100 --> 00:37:42,260 as superheroes, whose technological innovations 618 00:37:42,260 --> 00:37:45,740 could save society from our own government. 619 00:37:45,740 --> 00:37:48,580 But there's one man just across the valley 620 00:37:48,580 --> 00:37:52,420 who takes this belief to a much more extreme conclusion. 621 00:37:52,420 --> 00:37:57,580 He says that tech CEOs could be our kings. 622 00:37:57,580 --> 00:37:59,820 REPORTER: - Operating in the shadows of the internet, 623 00:37:59,820 --> 00:38:02,700 needless to say, is a man called Curtis Yarvin. 624 00:38:03,980 --> 00:38:06,900 - Curtis Yarvin, a former tech founder himself, 625 00:38:06,900 --> 00:38:11,060 has become the most prominent critic of democracy in the Western world. 626 00:38:12,180 --> 00:38:15,580 - You're going to basically shut down this fake executive branch 627 00:38:15,580 --> 00:38:17,940 that we have and create a new government. 628 00:38:17,940 --> 00:38:20,980 - Yarvin is accumulating powerful supporters... 629 00:38:20,980 --> 00:38:24,260 - Curtis, it's fantastic to have you on the show. - Great pleasure. 630 00:38:24,260 --> 00:38:27,340 - ..like the US billionaire Peter Thiel 631 00:38:27,340 --> 00:38:29,860 and figures in the current Trump administration, 632 00:38:29,860 --> 00:38:33,180 including the Vice President, JD Vance. 633 00:38:33,180 --> 00:38:35,060 - There's this guy, Curtis Yarvin, 634 00:38:35,060 --> 00:38:38,140 who's written about some of these things. 635 00:38:38,140 --> 00:38:40,580 - Yarvin believes that blockchain technology 636 00:38:40,580 --> 00:38:43,180 can be used to replace democratic governments 637 00:38:43,180 --> 00:38:47,860 with a corporate board ruled over by a CEO monarch, 638 00:38:47,860 --> 00:38:50,580 a tech king, if you will. 639 00:38:52,220 --> 00:38:54,780 He has agreed to meet me here in the heartland 640 00:38:54,780 --> 00:38:57,740 of America's liberal intelligentsia, Berkeley... 641 00:38:57,740 --> 00:39:00,220 Matt, good to meet you. - Pleasure to meet you. 642 00:39:00,220 --> 00:39:03,740 - ..to make the case for techno-monarchy. 643 00:39:03,740 --> 00:39:07,780 - Sort of the conflict of the period is essentially... - Right. 644 00:39:07,780 --> 00:39:10,420 - ..the people have always been against mass migration. 645 00:39:10,420 --> 00:39:13,780 Mass migration happens. Therefore, there is a lack of power there. 646 00:39:13,780 --> 00:39:16,140 - Uh-huh. - So, obviously, it's in these institutional 647 00:39:16,140 --> 00:39:20,060 meritocratic structures with these ancient brand names, right? 648 00:39:23,220 --> 00:39:25,340 Absolutely. So, actually, the amount 649 00:39:25,340 --> 00:39:27,620 that he has is not actually very high. 650 00:39:27,620 --> 00:39:30,220 It's actually very low. - OK. 651 00:39:30,220 --> 00:39:31,660 And just to sum up, 652 00:39:31,660 --> 00:39:35,620 because unfortunately this is a documentary, 653 00:39:35,620 --> 00:39:38,580 where we have limited time in the film to cover this... - Absolutely. 654 00:39:38,580 --> 00:39:40,300 - ..in the simplest possible terms, 655 00:39:40,300 --> 00:39:43,980 how would you define your ideal political system? 656 00:39:43,980 --> 00:39:47,340 - I would define it as an accountable monarchy. 657 00:39:47,340 --> 00:39:50,020 I think that people can very easily see that 658 00:39:50,020 --> 00:39:54,020 there's a very simple analogy between, 659 00:39:54,020 --> 00:39:56,700 um, a company and a state. 660 00:39:56,700 --> 00:40:00,260 When we look at any functional structure 661 00:40:00,260 --> 00:40:02,700 that involves more than a few people, 662 00:40:02,700 --> 00:40:05,660 we always see that it is organised as a monarchy. 663 00:40:05,660 --> 00:40:08,020 We always see a pyramid-shaped org chart. 664 00:40:08,020 --> 00:40:11,020 A company has a CEO, an army has a general, 665 00:40:11,020 --> 00:40:12,860 a film has a director. 666 00:40:12,860 --> 00:40:15,220 This is just nothing other than monarchism. 667 00:40:15,220 --> 00:40:18,940 So the patchwork system is an idea that's orthogonal to that. 668 00:40:18,940 --> 00:40:22,460 It's the idea that the greatest human flourishing 669 00:40:22,460 --> 00:40:24,540 has been seen historically 670 00:40:24,540 --> 00:40:27,700 in periods with large numbers of small states. 671 00:40:27,700 --> 00:40:30,620 - So what we're talking about here is a collection 672 00:40:30,620 --> 00:40:34,940 of kind of city states run by CEO monarch-type figures. 673 00:40:34,940 --> 00:40:37,580 But fundamentally, you're talking about a monarchy, right? 674 00:40:37,580 --> 00:40:40,060 - Fundamentally, I'm talking about a monarchy. - You're talking about 675 00:40:40,060 --> 00:40:42,180 a monarchy. If we were alive during the time of the Tudors, 676 00:40:42,180 --> 00:40:45,900 if a noble did something bad to us, we would have no... 677 00:40:45,900 --> 00:40:48,740 - Oh, my gosh. - No way to hold them to account. - That's a completely... 678 00:40:48,740 --> 00:40:50,020 - And we wouldn't be nobles. 679 00:40:50,020 --> 00:40:52,780 - That's a completely... Well, you know, two things. 680 00:40:52,780 --> 00:40:56,140 One is that, actually, we would be, 681 00:40:56,140 --> 00:40:59,820 because the thing is, one of the things you see historically is... 682 00:40:59,820 --> 00:41:02,180 - We'd be peasants. If they tried to do anything to us, 683 00:41:02,180 --> 00:41:04,780 we would have no courts or legal system. - So if you're imagining... 684 00:41:04,780 --> 00:41:07,980 If you're... First of all, I don't know where... 685 00:41:07,980 --> 00:41:11,220 - Statistically we would be peasants. - I don't... You have this caricature 686 00:41:11,220 --> 00:41:14,580 of, like, have you ever... Like, how much do you know 687 00:41:14,580 --> 00:41:17,060 about the world before, like, 1900? - OK. 688 00:41:17,060 --> 00:41:18,780 Let's start with the world after 1900. 689 00:41:18,780 --> 00:41:20,860 So could blockchain technology be used 690 00:41:20,860 --> 00:41:23,380 to implement the kind of monarchy CEO system? 691 00:41:23,380 --> 00:41:25,740 - Well, it could be used in two ways. It can be used to implement 692 00:41:25,740 --> 00:41:28,540 a corporation-like structure on the blockchain. 693 00:41:28,540 --> 00:41:31,460 So a monarchy that's essentially accountable 694 00:41:31,460 --> 00:41:33,580 to something like a board of directors. 695 00:41:33,580 --> 00:41:35,420 Now, when you look at a corporation, 696 00:41:35,420 --> 00:41:37,180 in a way, it's a kind of virtual state. 697 00:41:37,180 --> 00:41:40,700 It's like a state at a lower level. It pretends to be a state. 698 00:41:40,700 --> 00:41:42,900 But Microsoft can't really attack Oracle 699 00:41:42,900 --> 00:41:44,620 by sending, you know, troops of thugs 700 00:41:44,620 --> 00:41:47,060 to Oracle's headquarters to go beat up the engineers. - Right. 701 00:41:47,060 --> 00:41:50,180 - Although they probably should, but... - I'm sure they'd like to. 702 00:41:50,180 --> 00:41:53,100 - I'm sure they'd like to. Yes, definitely, it's the vibe sometimes. 703 00:41:53,100 --> 00:41:55,860 But you can't do that, because you're in a civil society 704 00:41:55,860 --> 00:41:58,300 run by a government. But the definition of a government... 705 00:41:58,300 --> 00:42:00,580 - Hey, maybe this whole government thing is a good idea. 706 00:42:00,580 --> 00:42:03,620 - It's an excellent idea, and I think it should be carried on 707 00:42:03,620 --> 00:42:04,900 much better than it is. 708 00:42:10,820 --> 00:42:15,460 - Up until now, from Justin Sun to Liberland and Tim Draper, 709 00:42:15,460 --> 00:42:18,540 everyone has been telling me how blockchain technology 710 00:42:18,540 --> 00:42:20,980 and cryptocurrency can free us 711 00:42:20,980 --> 00:42:24,500 and our money from government control. 712 00:42:24,500 --> 00:42:28,700 But Curtis Yarvin has me wondering, who are we handing the control to? 713 00:42:30,260 --> 00:42:34,260 Instead of banks and governments, could we end up handing it 714 00:42:34,260 --> 00:42:37,620 to a bunch of blockchain-appointed monarchs instead? 715 00:42:44,380 --> 00:42:47,980 The answer to this question may lie in Singapore, 716 00:42:47,980 --> 00:42:49,700 where the most powerful figures 717 00:42:49,700 --> 00:42:53,300 in crypto are due to gather this weekend. 718 00:42:53,300 --> 00:42:57,220 This is the biggest cryptocurrency conference in the world. 719 00:42:57,220 --> 00:42:59,180 It's called Token2049. 720 00:42:59,180 --> 00:43:03,860 There are 25,000 attendees from over 160 different countries. 721 00:43:03,860 --> 00:43:06,700 They've all come here to Singapore just for this. 722 00:43:06,700 --> 00:43:10,980 And one of the main sponsors is Justin Sun's Tron Company. 723 00:43:10,980 --> 00:43:14,140 One of the headline speakers is World Liberty Financial, 724 00:43:14,140 --> 00:43:16,700 the Trump family's crypto venture. 725 00:43:16,700 --> 00:43:19,460 World Liberty Financial is a crypto project 726 00:43:19,460 --> 00:43:21,140 set up by the Trump family, 727 00:43:21,140 --> 00:43:24,140 supposedly inspired by the president's vision. 728 00:43:24,140 --> 00:43:28,140 President Trump's special envoy to the Middle East, Steve Witkoff, 729 00:43:28,140 --> 00:43:30,980 is a co-founder emeritus of the company. 730 00:43:30,980 --> 00:43:34,460 World Liberty Financial is run in part by the two men's sons, 731 00:43:34,460 --> 00:43:37,340 including Donald Trump Jr, Eric Trump, 732 00:43:37,340 --> 00:43:41,100 Barron Trump and Zach Witkoff. 733 00:43:41,100 --> 00:43:45,940 It's in this Trump family crypto venture that Justin Sun 734 00:43:45,940 --> 00:43:48,700 poured over $75 million. 735 00:43:52,020 --> 00:43:55,780 As I wait for Trump Jr's speech, the conference gives me a taste 736 00:43:55,780 --> 00:43:58,340 of just how much money there is in crypto. 737 00:43:58,340 --> 00:44:01,140 What do you think? What do you think? 738 00:44:01,140 --> 00:44:03,620 A lot of it is giving 739 00:44:03,620 --> 00:44:07,780 the vibe of like a small slot machine casino. 740 00:44:07,780 --> 00:44:10,380 Like, everything's rewards if you like sign up 741 00:44:10,380 --> 00:44:13,500 and, you know, it's all very... I don't know, it's giving casino. 742 00:44:16,340 --> 00:44:17,900 - Please press the go button... 743 00:44:18,900 --> 00:44:21,940 - It's a bit slower than playing with a human. 744 00:44:21,940 --> 00:44:23,860 - Would you like robots to stay in the background 745 00:44:23,860 --> 00:44:26,620 or stand beside people as visible partners? 746 00:44:26,620 --> 00:44:28,460 - I'm asking the questions here, I think. 747 00:44:28,460 --> 00:44:29,660 - Touche, Matt! 748 00:44:31,180 --> 00:44:34,260 - It's all about seamless payments, global freedom, 749 00:44:34,260 --> 00:44:36,420 untraceable wallets. 750 00:44:36,420 --> 00:44:39,220 It's like, why does everyone need all their money 751 00:44:39,220 --> 00:44:42,300 to be so untraceable? Like, what's everyone up to? 752 00:44:42,300 --> 00:44:44,220 Everyone here seems to agree 753 00:44:44,220 --> 00:44:46,900 that the government can't be trusted with our money. 754 00:44:46,900 --> 00:44:48,300 - We want to trust the government, 755 00:44:48,300 --> 00:44:51,180 but at the same time, we know that we cannot 100% trust them. 756 00:44:51,180 --> 00:44:54,700 So I think there will have to be decentralised systems. 757 00:44:54,700 --> 00:44:56,500 - Like, no government controls you. 758 00:44:56,500 --> 00:44:59,340 And I had some problems with the government. 759 00:44:59,340 --> 00:45:02,220 - So there will be this one world leader that's going 760 00:45:02,220 --> 00:45:05,660 to drive down to the masses, OK, 761 00:45:05,660 --> 00:45:08,940 that you cannot buy or sell unless you got his mark - 666. 762 00:45:08,940 --> 00:45:12,820 And that is trackable using blockchain technology. 763 00:45:12,820 --> 00:45:16,220 - There is a new world order coming 764 00:45:16,220 --> 00:45:18,820 with a satanic sort of vibe. 765 00:45:18,820 --> 00:45:22,700 - This golden age, the new world order is coming to power soon. 766 00:45:22,700 --> 00:45:26,660 - OK. - And with this person in power, he will drive down this digital... 767 00:45:26,660 --> 00:45:29,340 - Who is the person? - He's yet to be revealed. 768 00:45:29,340 --> 00:45:32,900 - OK. Of course. Right. Yeah. Got it. 769 00:45:33,980 --> 00:45:35,780 Satanic conspiracies aside, 770 00:45:35,780 --> 00:45:38,020 people here are serious in their belief 771 00:45:38,020 --> 00:45:42,220 that crypto is the way to free money from government control. 772 00:45:42,220 --> 00:45:45,700 But are they simply handing that control to a new elite? 773 00:45:52,620 --> 00:45:56,220 Donald Trump Jr's talk on World Liberty Financial is about to begin. 774 00:46:02,780 --> 00:46:04,340 - Thank you, ladies. Appreciate it. 775 00:46:04,340 --> 00:46:06,660 - Donald Trump Jr and Zach Witkoff 776 00:46:06,660 --> 00:46:09,820 repeatedly claim the company is not political. 777 00:46:09,820 --> 00:46:13,820 - World Liberty is not a political organisation. We are a business. 778 00:46:13,820 --> 00:46:16,900 - President Trump officially stepped down from the company 779 00:46:16,900 --> 00:46:18,020 once he took office. 780 00:46:19,500 --> 00:46:23,220 But his family trust still own and profit from it, 781 00:46:23,220 --> 00:46:27,700 and his face is quite literally all over the project. 782 00:46:27,700 --> 00:46:29,980 - Yes, of course, we think President Trump is 783 00:46:29,980 --> 00:46:34,060 the greatest president to ever exist in the history of the world. 784 00:46:34,060 --> 00:46:36,940 - Donald Trump Jr claims that World Liberty Financial 785 00:46:36,940 --> 00:46:39,260 was created after his family's money 786 00:46:39,260 --> 00:46:42,340 was rejected by the traditional banking system. 787 00:46:42,340 --> 00:46:45,220 - Once we did get political, which... We got quite political, 788 00:46:45,220 --> 00:46:49,140 we woke up one morning and had 300 bank accounts just eliminated. 789 00:46:49,140 --> 00:46:50,660 - So they embraced crypto 790 00:46:50,660 --> 00:46:54,580 to free their money, and yours, from the banks. 791 00:46:54,580 --> 00:46:57,540 - Right, we got into crypto because out of necessity. We were debanked, 792 00:46:57,540 --> 00:46:59,260 so we came up with a solution. 793 00:46:59,260 --> 00:47:01,580 - World Liberty Financial's main product is 794 00:47:01,580 --> 00:47:04,740 a cryptocurrency coin called USD1. 795 00:47:04,740 --> 00:47:06,660 It's what's known as a stablecoin, 796 00:47:06,660 --> 00:47:10,940 a type of cryptocurrency designed to always be worth one US dollar, 797 00:47:10,940 --> 00:47:15,300 backed by real world assets like cash or government bonds. 798 00:47:15,300 --> 00:47:19,260 - World Liberty is shaping the future of all finance, 799 00:47:19,260 --> 00:47:20,980 and it's supercharged by a stablecoin 800 00:47:20,980 --> 00:47:24,300 they released earlier this year called USD1. 801 00:47:24,300 --> 00:47:27,940 - The Trumps have now reportedly made 802 00:47:27,940 --> 00:47:32,740 over $2.3 billion from their crypto businesses 803 00:47:32,740 --> 00:47:35,740 and stand to make much, much more. 804 00:47:35,740 --> 00:47:39,060 - And it's only the beginning. It's only going to get much stronger. 805 00:47:39,060 --> 00:47:41,140 - World Liberty Financial's ability 806 00:47:41,140 --> 00:47:44,380 to make millions of dollars for the Trump Family Trust, 807 00:47:44,380 --> 00:47:46,660 and its connections to the sitting president, 808 00:47:46,660 --> 00:47:49,660 have led to increased public scrutiny of the company, 809 00:47:49,660 --> 00:47:51,740 and, in particular, why people 810 00:47:51,740 --> 00:47:54,580 like Justin Sun have invested in it. 811 00:48:00,260 --> 00:48:03,140 Back in 2020, under President Biden, 812 00:48:03,140 --> 00:48:05,020 the US financial regulator, 813 00:48:05,020 --> 00:48:08,020 the Securities and Exchange Commission, or SEC, 814 00:48:08,020 --> 00:48:11,460 began to turn its eye towards the crypto industry. 815 00:48:11,460 --> 00:48:14,540 They claimed it was rife with fraud and criminality, 816 00:48:14,540 --> 00:48:17,900 and began investigating those they believed were responsible. 817 00:48:19,300 --> 00:48:21,940 One target was Justin Sun, 818 00:48:21,940 --> 00:48:23,860 and in March 2023, 819 00:48:23,860 --> 00:48:26,020 the SEC charged him with fraud, 820 00:48:26,020 --> 00:48:28,780 claiming he manipulated the price of his tokens 821 00:48:28,780 --> 00:48:30,700 and hid payments to celebrities 822 00:48:30,700 --> 00:48:32,340 who promoted them to the public. 823 00:48:34,020 --> 00:48:37,460 - I pledge to the Bitcoin community that the day 824 00:48:37,460 --> 00:48:41,060 I take the oath of office, Joe Biden and Kamala Harris's 825 00:48:41,060 --> 00:48:43,700 anti-crypto crusade will be over. 826 00:48:43,700 --> 00:48:47,100 On day one, I will fire Gary Gensler 827 00:48:47,100 --> 00:48:49,860 and appoint a new SEC chairman. 828 00:48:49,860 --> 00:48:51,780 - Then Trump was elected, 829 00:48:51,780 --> 00:48:56,460 and shortly afterwards, Sun invested in the Trump family crypto project, 830 00:48:56,460 --> 00:48:58,500 World Liberty Financial. 831 00:48:58,500 --> 00:49:02,140 Shortly after that, the SEC, now restaffed 832 00:49:02,140 --> 00:49:05,060 by Trump with crypto-friendly appointees... 833 00:49:05,060 --> 00:49:07,940 - I'm really honoured by your trust and confidence 834 00:49:07,940 --> 00:49:09,580 that you've placed in me. 835 00:49:09,580 --> 00:49:13,580 - ..paused multiple crypto-related investigations, including Sun's. 836 00:49:16,500 --> 00:49:19,140 Within a year, the case was dismissed 837 00:49:19,140 --> 00:49:23,540 and Sun paid a $10 million sum as part of the settlement. 838 00:49:23,540 --> 00:49:25,060 He denies the charges. 839 00:49:28,300 --> 00:49:29,940 - Are you ready? 840 00:49:29,940 --> 00:49:32,780 - CHEERING 841 00:49:32,780 --> 00:49:35,300 But Justin Sun isn't the only example 842 00:49:35,300 --> 00:49:38,060 of a major figure in the crypto industry 843 00:49:38,060 --> 00:49:41,420 having investigations paused or charges dropped 844 00:49:41,420 --> 00:49:44,740 after ploughing money into the Trump family's company. 845 00:49:45,740 --> 00:49:50,300 In August 2024, CZ, the CEO of Binance, 846 00:49:50,300 --> 00:49:52,420 the world's largest crypto company, 847 00:49:52,420 --> 00:49:54,820 began serving a four-month prison sentence 848 00:49:54,820 --> 00:49:56,780 for crimes related to money laundering. 849 00:49:58,380 --> 00:50:02,900 While in prison, Binance set up a $2 billion deal 850 00:50:02,900 --> 00:50:06,020 with an investment firm linked to the Emirati royals. 851 00:50:07,860 --> 00:50:10,180 The currency used in this deal was 852 00:50:10,180 --> 00:50:14,100 World Liberty Financial's USD1 token, 853 00:50:14,100 --> 00:50:16,180 reportedly generating the company 854 00:50:16,180 --> 00:50:19,860 between $40 million and $80 million a year. 855 00:50:29,500 --> 00:50:31,340 After the deal was completed, 856 00:50:31,340 --> 00:50:33,220 Trump gave Binance's CEO 857 00:50:33,220 --> 00:50:35,940 a presidential pardon and he was set free. 858 00:50:37,660 --> 00:50:41,420 People started to ask if these two events were related. 859 00:50:41,420 --> 00:50:44,580 - How do you address the appearance of pay for play? 860 00:50:44,580 --> 00:50:46,740 - Well, here's the thing, I know nothing about it 861 00:50:46,740 --> 00:50:48,180 because I'm too busy doing the other. 862 00:50:48,180 --> 00:50:50,060 - But he got a pardon. - I only tell you... - But he got a pardon. 863 00:50:50,060 --> 00:50:53,860 - I can only tell you this. My sons are into it, 864 00:50:53,860 --> 00:50:57,100 and I'm glad they are, because it's probably a great industry, crypto. 865 00:50:57,100 --> 00:50:58,940 I think it's good. You know, they're running a business. 866 00:50:58,940 --> 00:51:02,060 They're not in government. I know nothing about the guy. 867 00:51:04,420 --> 00:51:07,260 - Donald Trump is clear there is no connection between 868 00:51:07,260 --> 00:51:09,980 any decision taken by the SEC and the investments 869 00:51:09,980 --> 00:51:14,180 in his family companies made by either Binance or Justin Sun. 870 00:51:14,180 --> 00:51:17,300 - Cameras rolling. - I wanted to get Sun's take. 871 00:51:19,980 --> 00:51:22,340 Some people have pointed specifically to 872 00:51:22,340 --> 00:51:26,220 the timing of the SEC investigation being paused 873 00:51:26,220 --> 00:51:28,340 being around the time that you invested heavily 874 00:51:28,340 --> 00:51:30,300 in the Trump family crypto projects. - Yes. 875 00:51:30,300 --> 00:51:34,100 Yes. - What is your response to those allegations 876 00:51:34,100 --> 00:51:37,260 about the kind of coincidence of that timing? 877 00:51:37,260 --> 00:51:39,540 - Sorry. - But he can say that, right? - Yeah. 878 00:51:42,940 --> 00:51:44,740 Uh, the current case. Yeah. 879 00:51:44,740 --> 00:51:46,780 - It's not us making those allegations. 880 00:51:46,780 --> 00:51:48,060 Other people have made them, 881 00:51:48,060 --> 00:51:50,940 so we then have to ask them, you know? - No comment. Yes, yes. 882 00:51:50,940 --> 00:51:53,180 - Some still make the criticism, 883 00:51:53,180 --> 00:51:56,220 they say this isn't about new technologies. 884 00:51:56,220 --> 00:51:59,060 This is about people, 885 00:51:59,060 --> 00:52:02,100 whether it's Donald Trump Jr or yourself, getting richer. 886 00:52:14,300 --> 00:52:17,860 How much have the Trumps profited from their relationship with you? 887 00:52:17,860 --> 00:52:19,020 - Uh... 888 00:52:20,980 --> 00:52:22,020 Yeah. 889 00:52:23,020 --> 00:52:25,660 - We do have to ask some questions about that, right? 890 00:52:25,660 --> 00:52:27,540 Because it is important to people. 891 00:52:27,540 --> 00:52:30,820 And, you know, we are a news organisation. 892 00:52:36,380 --> 00:52:38,260 Are you uncomfortable answering those questions? 893 00:52:42,060 --> 00:52:43,780 OK. But, you know, you've met Trump. 894 00:52:43,780 --> 00:52:45,860 You know, you're in business with his family. 895 00:52:45,860 --> 00:52:47,420 - Yeah. - Do you think 896 00:52:47,420 --> 00:52:51,380 that he is embracing crypto because it's a wise economic policy, 897 00:52:51,380 --> 00:52:54,660 or do you think it's because, as some have said, 898 00:52:54,660 --> 00:52:57,020 he's doing it to make money for him and his family trust? 899 00:53:08,580 --> 00:53:11,220 Tech billionaires like Justin Sun say 900 00:53:11,220 --> 00:53:14,740 that the blockchain is a better way to run society. 901 00:53:14,740 --> 00:53:16,620 The Trump family have discovered 902 00:53:16,620 --> 00:53:19,580 it can at least make them billions of dollars. 903 00:53:19,580 --> 00:53:23,060 Whatever their real motivations, an alliance has formed between 904 00:53:23,060 --> 00:53:25,340 the world of crypto and the White House. 905 00:53:25,340 --> 00:53:28,980 - The Genius Act creates a clear and simple regulatory framework 906 00:53:28,980 --> 00:53:33,340 to establish and unleash the immense promise 907 00:53:33,340 --> 00:53:36,500 of dollar-backed stablecoins. 908 00:53:37,660 --> 00:53:41,460 - To find out what effect this alliance is having on democracy, 909 00:53:41,460 --> 00:53:43,060 I spoke to a reporter 910 00:53:43,060 --> 00:53:46,780 who's an expert in crypto and in Justin Sun. 911 00:53:48,260 --> 00:53:49,740 - World Liberty Financial, 912 00:53:49,740 --> 00:53:52,900 anyone can invest in it, so it seems. 913 00:53:52,900 --> 00:53:55,660 They say that they do their own due diligence 914 00:53:55,660 --> 00:53:58,580 in checking out their primary investors. 915 00:53:58,580 --> 00:54:03,020 But I think that if a mogul like Justin Sun 916 00:54:03,020 --> 00:54:07,740 is easily able to plough a bunch of money into the project, 917 00:54:07,740 --> 00:54:09,980 it seems like a pretty accessible avenue. 918 00:54:09,980 --> 00:54:11,660 - Accessible for what? 919 00:54:11,660 --> 00:54:16,180 - This is a way to give money 920 00:54:16,180 --> 00:54:18,700 about as directly as you could 921 00:54:18,700 --> 00:54:21,380 to the president or his family. 922 00:54:21,380 --> 00:54:23,820 - The tech industry as a whole, 923 00:54:23,820 --> 00:54:26,260 how much power do they wield in the White House now? 924 00:54:26,260 --> 00:54:28,140 - Up until this point, 925 00:54:28,140 --> 00:54:33,260 the fossil fuel industry has been the biggest campaign finance donor. 926 00:54:33,260 --> 00:54:36,940 And this last election cycle, 927 00:54:36,940 --> 00:54:41,060 they contributed around $219 million. 928 00:54:41,060 --> 00:54:46,420 But crypto surpassed that and did 238 million, 929 00:54:46,420 --> 00:54:48,020 according to... - Wow. - Yeah. 930 00:54:48,020 --> 00:54:50,780 - So it's the most powerful lobby in US politics today. 931 00:54:50,780 --> 00:54:52,860 - Yes. In short order, it's become... 932 00:54:52,860 --> 00:54:56,020 It's just a wave of money at this point. 933 00:54:56,020 --> 00:55:01,300 When you take an example now, like the new White House ballroom, 934 00:55:01,300 --> 00:55:03,780 and you look at the list of donors now, 935 00:55:03,780 --> 00:55:06,700 it contains a lot of names we're familiar with, 936 00:55:06,700 --> 00:55:10,460 of companies like Apple, Amazon, Microsoft. 937 00:55:10,460 --> 00:55:14,820 But further down the list, you know, around eighth, ninth, tenth, 938 00:55:14,820 --> 00:55:17,500 you start seeing cryptocurrency companies - 939 00:55:17,500 --> 00:55:19,740 Coinbase, Ripple, Tether. 940 00:55:23,340 --> 00:55:26,740 - I think it'll be one of the great ballrooms anywhere in the world. 941 00:55:26,740 --> 00:55:30,700 It's about $300 million, and it's being paid for 100% 942 00:55:30,700 --> 00:55:32,980 by me and some friends of mine, donors. 943 00:55:37,100 --> 00:55:39,620 - Right now, the east wing of the White House 944 00:55:39,620 --> 00:55:41,580 is being demolished to make way 945 00:55:41,580 --> 00:55:44,900 for Trump's new $300 million ballroom. 946 00:55:44,900 --> 00:55:46,580 A lot of people have said this is 947 00:55:46,580 --> 00:55:49,300 a metaphor for how Trump sees the US government, 948 00:55:49,300 --> 00:55:52,900 but it's hard not to see another metaphor at play, too, 949 00:55:52,900 --> 00:55:55,500 which is that this demolition and the construction 950 00:55:55,500 --> 00:55:57,860 of this ballroom is almost entirely funded 951 00:55:57,860 --> 00:56:02,180 by tech and crypto billionaires and millionaires, 952 00:56:02,180 --> 00:56:05,780 and a lot of them don't just want to demolish the White House, 953 00:56:05,780 --> 00:56:09,580 they want to demolish the very economic and political structures 954 00:56:09,580 --> 00:56:12,060 that underwrite our entire society. 955 00:56:15,780 --> 00:56:19,620 The question is, what do they want to demolish it for? 956 00:56:21,060 --> 00:56:24,220 The promise was decentralisation, 957 00:56:24,220 --> 00:56:27,700 freedom from the old power structures. 958 00:56:27,700 --> 00:56:32,220 But look at who's getting rich and who's gaining control. 959 00:56:32,220 --> 00:56:34,500 Every example I've seen ends 960 00:56:34,500 --> 00:56:38,820 in wealth and power flowing to whoever controls the technology. 961 00:56:40,620 --> 00:56:43,420 Our governments and financial systems are imperfect, 962 00:56:43,420 --> 00:56:45,100 but by tearing them down, 963 00:56:45,100 --> 00:56:49,500 are we simply handing their power to a newer, less accountable elite? 964 00:57:19,260 --> 00:57:22,380 - # Welcome to your life 965 00:57:23,580 --> 00:57:26,420 # There's no turning back 966 00:57:27,940 --> 00:57:30,860 # Even while we sleep 967 00:57:32,100 --> 00:57:34,340 # We will find you 968 00:57:34,340 --> 00:57:38,620 # Acting on your best behaviour 969 00:57:38,620 --> 00:57:42,900 # Turn your back on Mother Nature 970 00:57:42,900 --> 00:57:48,380 # Everybody wants to rule the world 971 00:57:57,900 --> 00:58:00,980 # It's my own design 972 00:58:02,220 --> 00:58:06,340 # It's my own remorse 973 00:58:06,340 --> 00:58:10,660 # Help me to decide 974 00:58:10,660 --> 00:58:14,900 # Help me make the most of freedom 975 00:58:14,900 --> 00:58:17,100 # And of pleasure 976 00:58:17,100 --> 00:58:21,340 # Nothing ever lasts forever 977 00:58:21,340 --> 00:58:26,300 # Everybody wants to rule the world 978 00:58:26,300 --> 00:58:27,740 # There's a room 979 00:58:27,740 --> 00:58:30,500 # Where the light won't find you 980 00:58:30,500 --> 00:58:35,060 # Holding hands while the walls come tumbling down 981 00:58:35,060 --> 00:58:39,020 # When they do, I'll be right behind you 982 00:58:39,020 --> 00:58:43,140 # So glad we've almost made it 983 00:58:43,140 --> 00:58:47,700 # So sad they had to fade it... # 984 00:58:47,700 --> 00:58:49,100 - Why don't we shake hands? 985 00:58:52,820 --> 00:58:54,900 - Excellent choice, Matt. 986 00:58:54,900 --> 00:58:56,420 Extending my hand. 987 00:58:56,420 --> 00:58:59,380 Don't worry. Robot grip is set to polite. 988 00:58:59,380 --> 00:59:02,980 Ready for the handshake? - I'm ready. Never been readier. 989 00:59:04,700 --> 00:59:06,460 Still ready. - Firm handshake. 990 00:59:08,900 --> 00:59:11,100 - Take your time. Take your time. - Steady and confident here. 991 00:59:13,340 --> 00:59:14,740 - Just slot it in there. 992 00:59:16,020 --> 00:59:19,060 Oh. - There we go, Matt. Handshake complete. - Yeah. 993 00:59:19,060 --> 00:59:20,900 - Not bad for a robot, right? - Well... 994 00:59:20,900 --> 00:59:23,340 - Should I practise my signature for autographs next?