1 00:00:51,500 --> 00:00:54,620 SIREN WAILS DISTANTLY 2 00:01:00,380 --> 00:01:02,940 INDISTINCT CHATTER 3 00:01:07,600 --> 00:01:10,540 Breaking news out of the city - police have confirmed reports 4 00:01:10,540 --> 00:01:12,300 that WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange 5 00:01:12,300 --> 00:01:13,380 has been arrested. 6 00:01:13,380 --> 00:01:16,700 One of the most notorious and controversial figures in the world 7 00:01:16,700 --> 00:01:18,140 is finally in custody. 8 00:01:18,140 --> 00:01:22,340 I can't even remember how I feel about Julian Assange. 9 00:01:25,780 --> 00:01:27,820 WikiLeaks! I love WikiLeaks. 10 00:01:27,820 --> 00:01:30,380 WOMAN: 10 years ago, Assange shot to fame 11 00:01:30,380 --> 00:01:33,100 when WikiLeaks began publishing secret documents 12 00:01:33,100 --> 00:01:37,180 provided by former US intelligence analyst Chelsea Manning. 13 00:01:37,180 --> 00:01:40,300 MAN: WikiLeaks first caught the attention of most Americans 14 00:01:40,300 --> 00:01:42,100 when it released this video. 15 00:01:42,100 --> 00:01:44,580 At least a dozen people were killed in the attack... 16 00:01:44,580 --> 00:01:45,660 GUNFIRE 17 00:01:45,660 --> 00:01:47,300 ..some of them innocent civilians. 18 00:01:50,180 --> 00:01:53,060 ..that the Metropolitan Police have arrested Julian Assange. 19 00:01:53,060 --> 00:01:54,740 MEMBERS: Hear, hear! 20 00:01:55,900 --> 00:01:57,420 Arrested for breach of bail 21 00:01:57,420 --> 00:01:59,900 after nearly seven years in the Ecuadorian Embassy. 22 00:01:59,900 --> 00:02:01,660 He has also been arrested 23 00:02:01,660 --> 00:02:03,300 in relation to an extradition request 24 00:02:03,300 --> 00:02:05,500 from the United States authorities. 25 00:02:05,500 --> 00:02:08,180 The Obama administration couldn't figure out how to charge him 26 00:02:08,180 --> 00:02:10,820 without him being able to get journalistic protection. 27 00:02:10,820 --> 00:02:12,620 I think it's pretty amazing, 28 00:02:12,620 --> 00:02:14,980 and the Trump administration should be, like, 29 00:02:14,980 --> 00:02:16,340 "Look at us. "We figured it out." 30 00:02:16,340 --> 00:02:19,220 MAN: Now, after eight years of cat and mouse, 31 00:02:19,220 --> 00:02:24,100 Julian Assange is on the precipice of extradition to the United States. 32 00:02:28,260 --> 00:02:30,060 You've said that you're proud of your son. 33 00:02:30,060 --> 00:02:31,740 You've now, if you like, broken cover, 34 00:02:31,740 --> 00:02:33,460 because we didn't really know about you 35 00:02:33,460 --> 00:02:35,100 until this morning, actually. 36 00:02:35,100 --> 00:02:38,620 Why have you decided that now is the time to speak up for him 37 00:02:38,620 --> 00:02:42,700 and to call for his repatriation to Australia? 38 00:02:42,700 --> 00:02:46,500 Well, he... Julian can no longer speak for himself, 39 00:02:46,500 --> 00:02:52,700 and so we... his family and friends must speak for him. 40 00:03:48,180 --> 00:03:50,620 MAN: Can we talk about the day Julian asked you to help? 41 00:03:50,620 --> 00:03:52,340 Can you talk me through that? 42 00:03:52,340 --> 00:03:54,060 I don't really remember. 43 00:03:54,060 --> 00:03:57,020 What I remember is that he got arrested, 44 00:03:57,020 --> 00:04:00,620 and so I came here and... 45 00:04:00,620 --> 00:04:02,540 went and saw him in the... 46 00:04:04,380 --> 00:04:07,660 ..went and saw Julian in the jail. 47 00:04:07,660 --> 00:04:10,580 Anyway, he was in a very bad way. 48 00:04:10,580 --> 00:04:13,580 OK. Yeah. Just... just tell me, how was Julian Assange? 49 00:04:13,580 --> 00:04:17,420 Oh, well, he's lost about 10 kilos' weight, 50 00:04:17,420 --> 00:04:23,300 and he's psychologically under a lot of stress and pressure. 51 00:04:23,300 --> 00:04:26,020 The visiting hours are very, very precious. 52 00:04:26,020 --> 00:04:28,260 SNIFFS Sorry. I'm a bit upset. 53 00:04:31,420 --> 00:04:33,940 Yes. This is my first visit. Yes. 54 00:04:35,300 --> 00:04:37,340 Yes. Yes. That... 55 00:04:37,340 --> 00:04:38,900 MAN: How was that? 56 00:04:38,900 --> 00:04:41,300 It's pretty moving, as you would expect. 57 00:04:41,300 --> 00:04:43,740 CAMERA CLICKS 58 00:04:43,740 --> 00:04:47,340 Pretty tough. For him, you know? 59 00:04:47,340 --> 00:04:48,860 CAMERA CLICKS 60 00:04:48,860 --> 00:04:51,580 I guess that'll do. Thank you. 61 00:04:51,580 --> 00:04:54,540 JOURNALISTS: Thank you. 62 00:04:54,540 --> 00:04:56,260 So I said, I'll... I'll be back." 63 00:04:56,260 --> 00:04:59,940 "I won't stop coming until you can come home." 64 00:04:59,940 --> 00:05:03,980 And I... I don't much like the media, but... 65 00:05:03,980 --> 00:05:06,980 it seems as though there was an avenue 66 00:05:06,980 --> 00:05:10,100 where I could contribute. 67 00:05:10,100 --> 00:05:12,580 MAN: Can we talk about your contact with Julian 68 00:05:12,580 --> 00:05:14,180 through his childhood? 69 00:05:14,180 --> 00:05:15,980 Well, I don't think it's a... 70 00:05:15,980 --> 00:05:18,340 You know, I don't think it'll help, will it? 71 00:05:18,340 --> 00:05:20,260 Well, just understanding 72 00:05:20,260 --> 00:05:22,460 that you didn't connect for a long time. 73 00:05:22,460 --> 00:05:24,260 Yeah. So why do we...? 74 00:05:24,260 --> 00:05:27,140 I mean, frankly, why do we have to go over that again? 75 00:05:27,140 --> 00:05:28,660 It's a serious question. 76 00:05:28,660 --> 00:05:31,460 Why do I have to go over the fact 77 00:05:31,460 --> 00:05:35,740 that I may not feel comfortable with your question? 78 00:05:35,740 --> 00:05:38,220 Mmm. Well, it's part of the story. 79 00:05:38,220 --> 00:05:40,380 It ISN'T part of the story. 80 00:05:40,380 --> 00:05:43,580 The story is that... you know, 81 00:05:43,580 --> 00:05:47,140 I am attempting, in my own humble - 82 00:05:47,140 --> 00:05:49,340 I don't like that word - 83 00:05:49,340 --> 00:05:53,540 modest way, to get Julian out of the shit. 84 00:05:53,540 --> 00:05:55,580 What does it involve? 85 00:05:55,580 --> 00:05:57,620 Traipsing around Europe, 86 00:05:57,620 --> 00:06:00,740 building up coalitions of friendship. 87 00:06:14,380 --> 00:06:16,260 And I have the feeling that 88 00:06:16,260 --> 00:06:19,540 the desire for a narrative about Julian 89 00:06:19,540 --> 00:06:23,140 is stronger than the desire 90 00:06:23,140 --> 00:06:28,060 to understand the person that you're speaking to, 91 00:06:28,060 --> 00:06:30,340 and what you're indirectly doing 92 00:06:30,340 --> 00:06:32,540 is making sense of life 93 00:06:32,540 --> 00:06:37,380 by imposing on life, as it flows past, a narrative, 94 00:06:37,380 --> 00:06:39,980 because that's what you want to see - 95 00:06:39,980 --> 00:06:43,220 a beginning, a middle, and an end and a conclusion - 96 00:06:43,220 --> 00:06:45,300 which is a convenient, 97 00:06:45,300 --> 00:06:49,540 or what I would call a Hollywood way of looking at life. 98 00:06:49,540 --> 00:06:52,980 But, you know, life's not really like that at all. 99 00:06:52,980 --> 00:06:55,820 So, what you can do with these things... 100 00:06:57,180 --> 00:07:00,260 ..is that you can give it a destiny. 101 00:07:01,540 --> 00:07:05,420 I would prefer the difficulty of destiny 102 00:07:05,420 --> 00:07:09,420 over the ease of narrative. 103 00:07:15,780 --> 00:07:18,060 It's good to see you. Yeah. 104 00:07:33,940 --> 00:07:37,340 CHEERING AND APPLAUSE 105 00:07:37,340 --> 00:07:40,140 Julian is suffering 106 00:07:40,140 --> 00:07:43,740 from years of psychological torture, 107 00:07:43,740 --> 00:07:48,100 increasing to the extent of damaging him. 108 00:07:52,660 --> 00:07:55,020 Thank you very much, ladies and gentlemen. 109 00:07:55,020 --> 00:07:59,740 Julian, of course, is not well. Um... 110 00:07:59,740 --> 00:08:02,780 WOMAN SPEAKS GERMAN 111 00:08:23,380 --> 00:08:26,180 NILS MELZER: So, I'm an independent human rights expert 112 00:08:26,180 --> 00:08:29,540 who's appointed directly by the United Nations. 113 00:08:29,540 --> 00:08:31,900 Well, Julian Assange's case, 114 00:08:31,900 --> 00:08:34,780 it does involve my mandate on several levels, 115 00:08:34,780 --> 00:08:36,700 although I... 116 00:08:36,700 --> 00:08:39,140 I at first didn't think so, and... 117 00:08:39,140 --> 00:08:43,540 that's the deceptive nature of psychological torture. 118 00:08:43,540 --> 00:08:46,620 That's the purpose of psychological torture. 119 00:08:46,620 --> 00:08:49,420 It wants to torture people without the environment realising 120 00:08:49,420 --> 00:08:51,220 someone is being tortured. 121 00:08:51,220 --> 00:08:53,260 Doesn't want to leave traces. 122 00:08:53,260 --> 00:08:55,980 Now, you DO leave traces, but it's in the mind. 123 00:08:55,980 --> 00:08:58,660 Torture is used to break people, 124 00:08:58,660 --> 00:09:02,500 very often to make them say what you want them to say, 125 00:09:02,500 --> 00:09:05,140 or not to say anything. 126 00:09:06,620 --> 00:09:08,660 But in Julian's case, 127 00:09:08,660 --> 00:09:10,980 it's about intimidating everybody else. 128 00:09:16,540 --> 00:09:19,100 Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. 129 00:09:27,260 --> 00:09:29,540 'I started this thing... 130 00:09:29,540 --> 00:09:32,860 'Oh, what was it? '73, I think.' 131 00:09:35,500 --> 00:09:36,540 Oh, oh, thank you. 132 00:09:36,540 --> 00:09:37,980 'And if I had... 133 00:09:37,980 --> 00:09:40,540 'you know, had that in my nature, 134 00:09:40,540 --> 00:09:42,740 'I would have been there already. 135 00:09:42,740 --> 00:09:46,940 'But I wasn't. You know, I liked building things. 136 00:09:46,940 --> 00:09:50,540 'Particularly liked building homes. 137 00:09:50,540 --> 00:09:53,100 'Cos a... a home, you know, 138 00:09:53,100 --> 00:09:57,020 'is a stage for the theatre of life.' 139 00:09:57,020 --> 00:10:01,900 And it gathers the inhabitants under its roof 140 00:10:01,900 --> 00:10:05,860 like a hen gathers its chicks. 141 00:10:05,860 --> 00:10:07,500 So I liked that. 142 00:10:07,500 --> 00:10:12,180 That was what I liked doing, making those things. 143 00:10:12,180 --> 00:10:15,060 So, please have a seat. Ah. 144 00:10:15,060 --> 00:10:16,500 Thank you. All right. 145 00:10:16,500 --> 00:10:18,500 Just have to put this a little bit closer. 146 00:10:18,500 --> 00:10:19,740 Oh. That's OK for you? 147 00:10:19,740 --> 00:10:21,020 Yeah, yeah. Yeah. 148 00:10:28,980 --> 00:10:32,340 Well, I last saw Julian at three years of age, 149 00:10:32,340 --> 00:10:35,540 and then we re-met when he was in his 20s, 150 00:10:35,540 --> 00:10:41,260 so, as a child, I can only go by what his mum says. 151 00:10:41,260 --> 00:10:46,500 I think his nickname was "Wizard" 152 00:10:46,500 --> 00:10:49,220 and... and shortened to "Wizzy", 153 00:10:49,220 --> 00:10:54,220 because he was precocious and inventive and... Yeah. 154 00:11:00,500 --> 00:11:02,660 Is that correct? Yeah. Yes. Yeah. 155 00:11:02,660 --> 00:11:06,140 He called in one day, 156 00:11:06,140 --> 00:11:10,860 and we made tea and avocado toast, 157 00:11:10,860 --> 00:11:16,940 and we talked about secrecy, its benefits and its failures. 158 00:11:16,940 --> 00:11:24,380 And he said that the quality of a society 159 00:11:24,380 --> 00:11:29,980 is founded upon the information that it can get access to 160 00:11:29,980 --> 00:11:34,500 in order to build something that is more sturdy 161 00:11:34,500 --> 00:11:37,940 and has deeper knowledge of itself, 162 00:11:37,940 --> 00:11:44,260 and consequently can move to a higher plane of existence. 163 00:11:45,580 --> 00:11:49,100 They are... That is his, but paraphrased, 164 00:11:49,100 --> 00:11:53,260 because the conversations extended over days, you know? 165 00:12:03,820 --> 00:12:08,660 MAN: Ready to go live on the fly here on 99.5 FM in New York City. 166 00:12:08,660 --> 00:12:12,580 Today, I'm talking with Dr Niraj Lal, 167 00:12:12,580 --> 00:12:14,900 about Julian Assange. 168 00:12:14,900 --> 00:12:21,580 So, when did you first meet Julian Assange, Dr Niraj? 169 00:12:21,580 --> 00:12:24,100 First met Julian in 2002, 170 00:12:24,100 --> 00:12:27,820 in my first physics lecture at the University of Melbourne. 171 00:12:27,820 --> 00:12:31,700 And the question of whether Australia would go to war in Iraq 172 00:12:31,700 --> 00:12:33,660 was a topic of discussion. 173 00:12:34,780 --> 00:12:38,140 Julian was very much a passionate advocate 174 00:12:38,140 --> 00:12:40,060 for fairness, for justice. 175 00:12:40,060 --> 00:12:42,580 And millions of citizens were marching, 176 00:12:42,580 --> 00:12:46,180 to see if we could stop this war taking place, 177 00:12:46,180 --> 00:12:47,820 that I think people of the time 178 00:12:47,820 --> 00:12:49,260 knew that it wasn't actually 179 00:12:49,260 --> 00:12:51,940 about the safety of the Iraqi citizens themselves, 180 00:12:51,940 --> 00:12:54,820 or the safety of other nations around the world. 181 00:12:54,820 --> 00:12:57,220 And we saw this, and we marched, and we protested. 182 00:13:02,260 --> 00:13:04,220 And nothing happened. 183 00:13:05,300 --> 00:13:07,420 It didn't lead to anything. We still went to war. 184 00:13:13,300 --> 00:13:15,940 And Julian asked the question, 185 00:13:15,940 --> 00:13:18,740 "Well, if marching civilians can't do it, 186 00:13:18,740 --> 00:13:21,540 "if letters to our politicians don't do it, if... 187 00:13:21,540 --> 00:13:23,220 "Well, what WILL change? 188 00:13:23,220 --> 00:13:26,100 "What WILL enable us to prevent going to an illegal war?" 189 00:13:26,100 --> 00:13:29,020 And Julian's idea, with WikiLeaks, 190 00:13:29,020 --> 00:13:32,020 was that the goal is justice and the method is transparency, 191 00:13:32,020 --> 00:13:36,100 to show the public what's really going on. 192 00:13:36,100 --> 00:13:39,980 This movement is not about the destruction of law. 193 00:13:39,980 --> 00:13:43,340 It is about the construction of law! 194 00:13:59,740 --> 00:14:03,660 MAN: In July 2010, WikiLeaks and its collaborators 195 00:14:03,660 --> 00:14:06,140 went public with a massive leak. 196 00:14:06,140 --> 00:14:08,460 The Afghan War logs came from a trove 197 00:14:08,460 --> 00:14:11,860 of 90,000 incident and intelligence reports. 198 00:14:11,860 --> 00:14:14,300 MAN: WikiLeaks released this video. 199 00:14:14,300 --> 00:14:17,540 It shows a US Apache helicopter crew in Iraq 200 00:14:17,540 --> 00:14:19,620 opening fire on a group of men. 201 00:14:19,620 --> 00:14:21,900 Some of them were journalists from Reuters. 202 00:14:21,900 --> 00:14:24,900 GUNFIRE Come on. Fire. 203 00:14:24,900 --> 00:14:26,500 Keep shooting. 204 00:14:26,500 --> 00:14:31,540 We have clear evidence for war crimes having been committed. 205 00:14:53,700 --> 00:14:56,380 WOMAN: His appearance has changed dramatically since April, 206 00:14:56,380 --> 00:14:58,220 when he was dragged by police 207 00:14:58,220 --> 00:15:00,780 from the Ecuadorian Embassy in London. 208 00:15:00,780 --> 00:15:04,460 MAN: A thin and confused-looking Julian Assange 209 00:15:04,460 --> 00:15:07,940 has been seen for the first time since his April arrest, 210 00:15:07,940 --> 00:15:09,340 the WikiLeaks founder 211 00:15:09,340 --> 00:15:11,140 struggling to remember his birthday 212 00:15:11,140 --> 00:15:15,500 as he was told his extradition hearing WILL go ahead. 213 00:15:15,500 --> 00:15:17,700 WOMAN: Fronting Westminster Magistrates' Court 214 00:15:17,700 --> 00:15:20,140 in a navy suit and clean-shaven, 215 00:15:20,140 --> 00:15:22,980 the WikiLeaks founder was noticeably thinner, 216 00:15:22,980 --> 00:15:25,140 struggling to remember his birth date, 217 00:15:25,140 --> 00:15:27,340 saying, "I can't think properly." 218 00:15:27,340 --> 00:15:28,900 Assange will remain behind bars 219 00:15:28,900 --> 00:15:30,500 until that full extradition hearing, 220 00:15:30,500 --> 00:15:33,260 which has been set down for the end of February. 221 00:16:14,060 --> 00:16:16,980 ANNOUNCEMENT: We will shortly be arriving at Farringdon. 222 00:16:19,380 --> 00:16:20,900 STELLA MORIS: I met Julian 223 00:16:20,900 --> 00:16:26,140 because I had responded to an email from Jennifer Robinson. 224 00:16:26,140 --> 00:16:29,500 The legal defence team needed more people. 225 00:16:29,500 --> 00:16:31,820 The case was developing very quickly, 226 00:16:31,820 --> 00:16:36,420 and I was brought on to work on the US investigation. 227 00:16:39,940 --> 00:16:42,500 In the beginning of Julian being in prison, 228 00:16:42,500 --> 00:16:45,700 he could only call a few times a week, 229 00:16:45,700 --> 00:16:50,460 when he was in the unit for desperately suicidal 230 00:16:50,460 --> 00:16:54,180 or terminally ill people, 231 00:16:54,180 --> 00:16:56,820 and most of the time, they're in isolation. 232 00:16:56,820 --> 00:17:00,260 So that's where Julian was for about six months. 233 00:17:00,260 --> 00:17:02,660 I mean, Julian's had a... 234 00:17:02,660 --> 00:17:08,180 a very... difficult time in the prison. 235 00:17:08,180 --> 00:17:10,620 CHILD CHATTERS 236 00:17:14,620 --> 00:17:17,260 JOHN: Yes, but that's not very nice. 237 00:17:17,260 --> 00:17:19,460 You have the nice one, the big one... 238 00:17:31,260 --> 00:17:32,660 WOMAN: Stella... 239 00:17:32,660 --> 00:17:35,140 WOMAN SPEAKS SWEDISH 240 00:17:42,780 --> 00:17:44,420 Did you rest well? I did. 241 00:17:44,420 --> 00:17:45,500 Oh. Yourself? 242 00:17:45,500 --> 00:17:48,820 Yes, I did. I feel... I feel human. 243 00:17:51,380 --> 00:17:52,940 Dad? Yeah? 244 00:18:08,380 --> 00:18:10,620 I took off my shoes already. 245 00:18:10,620 --> 00:18:13,460 'Severine, she asked when... 246 00:18:13,460 --> 00:18:17,340 'when I'm gonna get Julian out of jail, yeah. 247 00:18:17,340 --> 00:18:20,220 'Severine thinks it's an immediacy. 248 00:18:20,220 --> 00:18:22,620 'We're just coming to pick him up, you know? 249 00:18:22,620 --> 00:18:24,420 'Get in the cab and... 250 00:18:24,420 --> 00:18:28,220 'She doesn't really see that we might end up in America 251 00:18:28,220 --> 00:18:30,700 'fighting this battle.' 252 00:18:34,140 --> 00:18:38,460 You know, I find myself very different, 253 00:18:38,460 --> 00:18:43,500 in that I have cultivated within myself a love of family, 254 00:18:43,500 --> 00:18:47,820 because when I left school, 255 00:18:47,820 --> 00:18:50,820 or my father died, after he died, 256 00:18:50,820 --> 00:18:53,300 I got all the family photographs - 257 00:18:53,300 --> 00:18:55,500 oh, there was a fucking heap, I tell you - 258 00:18:55,500 --> 00:18:57,340 and I burnt them. 259 00:18:57,340 --> 00:19:00,540 I wasn't going back there, not for quids. 260 00:19:00,540 --> 00:19:02,540 What...? Er... 261 00:19:02,540 --> 00:19:04,380 What was going on when you did that? 262 00:19:04,380 --> 00:19:08,220 Oh, who knows? You know? Humans are complex. 263 00:19:08,220 --> 00:19:12,900 Um... And... so I built... 264 00:19:14,380 --> 00:19:20,340 ..copying from books and plays and... 265 00:19:21,420 --> 00:19:23,340 ..mentors... 266 00:19:23,340 --> 00:19:27,100 the elements of families in myself. 267 00:19:27,100 --> 00:19:29,100 Yeah, so I built it. 268 00:19:29,100 --> 00:19:32,460 It's a hou... my mansion, you know? 269 00:19:32,460 --> 00:19:36,780 And it has all these rooms, which I've... 270 00:19:36,780 --> 00:19:39,940 decorated, and put furniture in, 271 00:19:39,940 --> 00:19:42,300 and I move into them. 272 00:19:44,380 --> 00:19:46,260 No, that was me. 273 00:19:48,620 --> 00:19:50,940 It's still bottoming out somewhere. 274 00:19:52,980 --> 00:19:55,220 SOBBING: I want to stay with you. 275 00:19:55,220 --> 00:19:58,700 Darling, we have to go. 276 00:19:58,700 --> 00:20:00,460 We have to go. OK? 277 00:20:00,460 --> 00:20:03,260 SOBS: I want to be with you. 278 00:20:03,260 --> 00:20:05,940 Huh? Becau... You can't... 279 00:20:05,940 --> 00:20:08,380 Because we can't get in the jail. 280 00:20:08,380 --> 00:20:12,220 We're going to places no children... 281 00:20:12,220 --> 00:20:14,660 It's just an awful place I'm going to today. 282 00:20:36,980 --> 00:20:37,980 OK. 283 00:20:39,620 --> 00:20:40,940 For whom? 284 00:20:51,540 --> 00:20:53,220 For the lawyers? 285 00:20:55,420 --> 00:20:57,860 When you say "us", I don't understand. 286 00:20:59,780 --> 00:21:01,380 Oh. 287 00:21:06,460 --> 00:21:07,740 OK. 288 00:21:07,740 --> 00:21:09,740 about 289 00:21:09,740 --> 00:21:13,020 'how he... when he was... when he was a child, 290 00:21:13,020 --> 00:21:15,820 'growing up, he always...' 291 00:21:15,820 --> 00:21:17,660 knew he was different. 292 00:21:17,660 --> 00:21:19,540 And he says... 293 00:21:19,540 --> 00:21:21,780 that he wasn't... 294 00:21:21,780 --> 00:21:25,020 He wasn't afraid of an alien abduction. 295 00:21:25,020 --> 00:21:27,180 He was hoping that it would happen soon 296 00:21:27,180 --> 00:21:28,700 because he felt like an alien. 297 00:21:28,700 --> 00:21:31,940 This must be the explanation, right? 298 00:21:31,940 --> 00:21:34,140 So it was very funny to... 299 00:21:34,140 --> 00:21:38,700 to know that Julian and John had only reconnected 300 00:21:38,700 --> 00:21:40,900 when Julian was already a... 301 00:21:40,900 --> 00:21:43,660 you know, a mature adult. 302 00:21:45,780 --> 00:21:48,740 Because they are very similar in some ways. 303 00:21:48,740 --> 00:21:50,700 I mean, I think it's very... 304 00:21:50,700 --> 00:21:52,380 In ways that are noticeable, 305 00:21:52,380 --> 00:21:55,860 even to people who don't know them personally. 306 00:21:55,860 --> 00:21:59,740 Their thought processes are recognisable, 307 00:21:59,740 --> 00:22:02,420 ability to abstract... 308 00:22:02,420 --> 00:22:04,140 storytelling. 309 00:22:05,620 --> 00:22:08,580 And kind of a cheeky sense of humour. 310 00:22:08,580 --> 00:22:12,980 And he's been really, really good. 311 00:22:28,620 --> 00:22:31,980 LAUGHTER AND CHEERING 312 00:22:44,900 --> 00:22:48,300 JOHN SHIPTON: 'I get upset in that fuckin' place. 313 00:22:48,300 --> 00:22:50,940 'Three suicides and one murder this month.' 314 00:23:14,340 --> 00:23:17,500 MAN: And when did you first know about Julian and Stella? 315 00:23:19,500 --> 00:23:22,420 Generally speaking... 316 00:23:22,420 --> 00:23:25,140 SIGHS 317 00:23:27,420 --> 00:23:30,020 ..unlike other people... 318 00:23:32,780 --> 00:23:36,540 ..I don't invade people's privacy. 319 00:23:36,540 --> 00:23:42,340 Nor I am curious as to what, who's going out with whom... 320 00:23:42,340 --> 00:23:44,020 Um... 321 00:23:44,020 --> 00:23:46,540 So... 322 00:23:46,540 --> 00:23:50,940 If I saw anything that intimated... 323 00:23:52,540 --> 00:23:54,580 ..intimacy... 324 00:23:54,580 --> 00:23:58,580 I... ignored it, 325 00:23:58,580 --> 00:24:02,420 or put it under the list of familiarity. 326 00:24:13,500 --> 00:24:16,540 They've spent 10 years 327 00:24:16,540 --> 00:24:20,620 being pursued by four powers, 328 00:24:20,620 --> 00:24:25,980 one of them being the foremost power on Earth. 329 00:24:27,820 --> 00:24:30,140 In an extraordinary twist to the WikiLeaks story, 330 00:24:30,140 --> 00:24:33,220 Julian Assange, the founder of the whistle-blower website, 331 00:24:33,220 --> 00:24:36,220 has taken refuge in the Ecuador Embassy in London. 332 00:24:36,220 --> 00:24:37,620 Assange is seeking asylum 333 00:24:37,620 --> 00:24:39,860 because he fears extradition to Sweden 334 00:24:39,860 --> 00:24:42,060 may lead to his transfer to the United States, 335 00:24:42,060 --> 00:24:45,340 where he could potentially face charges relating to WikiLeaks. 336 00:25:01,980 --> 00:25:04,260 STELLA: It was around 2015 337 00:25:04,260 --> 00:25:07,580 that we got together in the embassy, 338 00:25:07,580 --> 00:25:10,300 and we discussed 339 00:25:10,300 --> 00:25:14,180 the impossibility of having children for a long time. 340 00:25:14,180 --> 00:25:18,140 And we experienced this both as... 341 00:25:18,140 --> 00:25:21,580 as a massive tragedy, because we had found each other. 342 00:25:21,580 --> 00:25:24,580 And in 2016... 343 00:25:24,580 --> 00:25:27,500 It seemed like 2016 was a turning point, 344 00:25:27,500 --> 00:25:30,260 because the UN Working Group on Arbitrary Detention 345 00:25:30,260 --> 00:25:33,460 had just ruled in favour of Julian and against the UK, 346 00:25:33,460 --> 00:25:36,180 saying that they were holding him without any legal basis 347 00:25:36,180 --> 00:25:38,580 and that they were actually violating international law 348 00:25:38,580 --> 00:25:40,980 by keeping him in the embassy, and... and... 349 00:25:40,980 --> 00:25:42,940 And it just seemed like... 350 00:25:42,940 --> 00:25:45,460 clearly, it was just a matter of time 351 00:25:45,460 --> 00:25:47,340 before Julian could walk free. 352 00:25:47,340 --> 00:25:49,780 So when we decided to start a family, 353 00:25:49,780 --> 00:25:51,940 it was in a context where there were no charges, 354 00:25:51,940 --> 00:25:53,740 there was no investigation, 355 00:25:53,740 --> 00:25:58,300 there was no reason for Julian to be stuck in that embassy. 356 00:25:59,300 --> 00:26:02,940 So we had Gabriel in mid-2017, 357 00:26:02,940 --> 00:26:06,540 and then I would bring him into the embassy 358 00:26:06,540 --> 00:26:08,420 with my friend Stephen, 359 00:26:08,420 --> 00:26:12,940 and... and that way, Julian was able to see our baby. 360 00:26:12,940 --> 00:26:16,540 And that continued for about six months. 361 00:26:31,820 --> 00:26:34,820 INDISTINCT CONVERSATION 362 00:26:52,940 --> 00:26:56,020 WHOOSHING 363 00:27:01,540 --> 00:27:05,780 STELLA: You know, the whole place was basically bugged by the CIA. 364 00:27:07,460 --> 00:27:09,140 Beginning of 2018, 365 00:27:09,140 --> 00:27:11,740 there was a grab team posted outside the embassy 366 00:27:11,740 --> 00:27:14,140 during the Christmas period. 367 00:27:14,140 --> 00:27:16,340 You know, the streets were deserted outside, 368 00:27:16,340 --> 00:27:19,140 and there this was car that was there, conspicuous, 369 00:27:19,140 --> 00:27:21,180 for... for us to see. 370 00:27:21,180 --> 00:27:23,820 And I remember John was there, and we had... 371 00:27:23,820 --> 00:27:28,220 we had Christmas dinner and... 372 00:27:28,220 --> 00:27:32,180 And we... you know, we knew these guys were sitting out there. 373 00:27:32,180 --> 00:27:35,700 We found out that there were plans to kill Julian 374 00:27:35,700 --> 00:27:39,900 by poisoning him and... 375 00:27:42,460 --> 00:27:44,620 ..abducting him from the embassy. 376 00:27:44,620 --> 00:27:45,980 Um... 377 00:27:45,980 --> 00:27:47,340 They grew... 378 00:27:48,460 --> 00:27:50,420 ..increasingly aggressive. 379 00:27:52,180 --> 00:27:55,060 It got so bad that I had... 380 00:27:55,060 --> 00:27:57,460 I was afraid about walking home at night. 381 00:27:59,460 --> 00:28:01,460 Because I thought, you know... 382 00:28:02,820 --> 00:28:07,020 ..I could just be beaten up and assaulted, or even killed, 383 00:28:07,020 --> 00:28:10,340 just as a message to Julian. 384 00:28:10,340 --> 00:28:12,620 And that's why towards 385 00:28:12,620 --> 00:28:16,100 the final three months of my second pregnancy, 386 00:28:16,100 --> 00:28:19,900 we decided it was best for me not to go in. 387 00:28:19,900 --> 00:28:22,580 And then Julian was arrested. 388 00:28:31,380 --> 00:28:33,380 CHILD CHATTERS 389 00:28:35,460 --> 00:28:37,540 STELLA: No? 390 00:28:37,540 --> 00:28:42,620 Oh, wow. We have a lot of stories to get through tonight. 391 00:28:44,380 --> 00:28:47,300 I will help you, Mama! 392 00:28:47,300 --> 00:28:49,580 Thank you. 393 00:28:49,580 --> 00:28:52,700 All right. Shall we start with The Gingerbread Man? 394 00:28:52,700 --> 00:28:54,300 Yeah. 395 00:28:55,740 --> 00:28:57,180 All right. 396 00:28:57,180 --> 00:28:59,860 "Once upon a time, there was a little old man. 397 00:28:59,860 --> 00:29:03,740 "One day, the little old woman made a gingerbread man." 398 00:29:06,020 --> 00:29:07,980 Maybe Fergus Finds A Friend? 399 00:29:13,420 --> 00:29:15,380 The Saggy Baggy Elephant? 400 00:29:18,620 --> 00:29:20,500 'That's quite good.' 401 00:29:20,500 --> 00:29:23,180 And the Going On A Lion Hunt? Did you say you knew that one? 402 00:29:31,500 --> 00:29:32,580 Mmm. 403 00:29:34,220 --> 00:29:38,220 It's the... the bear hunt one. They know the bear hunt one. 404 00:29:38,220 --> 00:29:39,940 "We're going on a bear hunt." 'Oh, yeah.' 405 00:29:39,940 --> 00:29:43,780 "We're gonna find... a big one." 406 00:30:00,540 --> 00:30:02,300 Can we come in? 407 00:30:02,300 --> 00:30:03,700 Ah. 408 00:30:03,700 --> 00:30:06,620 She cannot talk cos we've got to keep still. 409 00:30:09,340 --> 00:30:14,820 STELLA: Extraditions are 99% politics and 1% law. 410 00:30:14,820 --> 00:30:19,220 It's entirely the political climate around the case 411 00:30:19,220 --> 00:30:20,900 that decides the outcome, 412 00:30:20,900 --> 00:30:23,580 and that is shaped by the... by the media. 413 00:30:23,580 --> 00:30:28,660 And for many years, there was a climate that was created, 414 00:30:28,660 --> 00:30:31,420 deliberately created, through false stories, 415 00:30:31,420 --> 00:30:34,180 through smears, through kind of a character... 416 00:30:34,180 --> 00:30:37,020 relentless character attacks on Julian, 417 00:30:37,020 --> 00:30:39,220 to try to reduce that support 418 00:30:39,220 --> 00:30:43,060 and make it more possible, um... 419 00:30:43,060 --> 00:30:45,940 more likely, to successfully extradite him 420 00:30:45,940 --> 00:30:47,380 to the United States. 421 00:30:47,380 --> 00:30:51,300 'And... I think it took about a year 422 00:30:51,300 --> 00:30:53,020 'to really feel like I was in a place 423 00:30:53,020 --> 00:30:55,700 'where I could go public.' 424 00:30:55,700 --> 00:30:58,620 Oh, where are those notes? Can I just have a look? 425 00:31:08,980 --> 00:31:11,020 Thank you very much for talking to us. 426 00:31:11,020 --> 00:31:14,220 I want to ask you first of all how you first met Julian Assange 427 00:31:14,220 --> 00:31:15,940 and what you thought of him 428 00:31:15,940 --> 00:31:18,140 when you first met him nine years ago. 429 00:31:18,140 --> 00:31:22,180 I met Julian in Paddington, at the Frontline Club. 430 00:31:22,180 --> 00:31:27,220 I thought he was intriguing, a man with a... with a mission. 431 00:31:27,220 --> 00:31:30,380 Julian Assange went into the Ecuadorian Embassy in London 432 00:31:30,380 --> 00:31:33,940 because he wanted to avoid being extradited to Sweden 433 00:31:33,940 --> 00:31:36,980 to face questioning about allegations of sexual assault. 434 00:31:36,980 --> 00:31:39,500 You know that case very well. 435 00:31:39,500 --> 00:31:41,380 What did you think of the allegations made 436 00:31:41,380 --> 00:31:43,940 by Miss A and Miss W against him? 437 00:31:43,940 --> 00:31:46,580 What has to be understood 438 00:31:46,580 --> 00:31:49,020 about the Swedish preliminary investigation - 439 00:31:49,020 --> 00:31:51,580 because it was always a preliminary investigation - 440 00:31:51,580 --> 00:31:53,940 was that Julian always cooperated. 441 00:31:53,940 --> 00:31:58,300 He did not go into the embassy because he was avoiding questioning. 442 00:31:58,300 --> 00:32:00,620 In fact, he was offering questioning. 443 00:32:00,620 --> 00:32:02,340 Julian was never charged. 444 00:32:02,340 --> 00:32:07,140 None of their names should have been leaked, including Julian's. 445 00:32:07,140 --> 00:32:08,860 I think the Swedish prosecution... 446 00:32:08,860 --> 00:32:10,060 It's too long. 447 00:32:10,060 --> 00:32:11,700 I told him it's too long, 448 00:32:11,700 --> 00:32:13,700 but they don't take any notice of me. 449 00:32:13,700 --> 00:32:16,820 One hour, maximum. 450 00:32:20,460 --> 00:32:24,420 These stupid PR people. Just sick of them. 451 00:32:25,820 --> 00:32:29,700 Earlier this year, you said, "Everyone has failed Julian. 452 00:32:29,700 --> 00:32:31,420 "We've all failed Julian." 453 00:32:31,420 --> 00:32:32,860 What did you mean? 454 00:32:32,860 --> 00:32:35,860 I mean that Julian... 455 00:32:38,100 --> 00:32:41,180 ..is... extremely vulnerable. 456 00:32:41,180 --> 00:32:47,620 Now physically in the country's highest-security prison, 457 00:32:47,620 --> 00:32:51,020 he's in there because he exposed torture. 458 00:32:51,020 --> 00:32:53,300 The contrast... 459 00:32:53,300 --> 00:32:55,660 ..just the... Sorry. 460 00:33:03,580 --> 00:33:06,460 The injustice is overwhelming. 461 00:33:09,220 --> 00:33:13,540 And it's hard, year after year. 462 00:33:13,540 --> 00:33:15,940 I don't think this is people's values. 463 00:33:15,940 --> 00:33:19,620 I don't think they think that people who expose war crimes 464 00:33:19,620 --> 00:33:22,300 should go to prison for the rest of their lives. 465 00:33:23,900 --> 00:33:25,300 SNIFFS 466 00:33:29,060 --> 00:33:30,500 Uh, perhaps... 467 00:33:34,300 --> 00:33:35,740 SNIFFS 468 00:33:37,260 --> 00:33:39,500 Do you want some tissue, yeah? 469 00:33:43,140 --> 00:33:45,260 Are you OK? 470 00:33:49,220 --> 00:33:52,580 Use this one. Thanks. 471 00:33:54,660 --> 00:33:56,860 Pear. You're eating pear. 472 00:34:13,260 --> 00:34:16,100 How do you deal with the fact that... 473 00:34:17,740 --> 00:34:20,740 ..your fiance may lose his fight against extradition, 474 00:34:20,740 --> 00:34:22,220 he may be sent to America, 475 00:34:22,220 --> 00:34:24,420 he may be tried, he may be jailed? 476 00:34:24,420 --> 00:34:26,620 How do you cope with that? 477 00:34:26,620 --> 00:34:30,620 It's not a... It's not a choice. 478 00:34:30,620 --> 00:34:33,500 Um... You love who you love, and... 479 00:34:33,500 --> 00:34:36,900 I love Julian for the courageous person he is, 480 00:34:36,900 --> 00:34:38,900 and I'll stand by him. 481 00:34:44,700 --> 00:34:46,580 Open the door. 482 00:34:46,580 --> 00:34:48,980 NILS MELZER: When Julian's legal team contacted me, 483 00:34:48,980 --> 00:34:51,420 I have to admit, I mean, I just saw the message 484 00:34:51,420 --> 00:34:54,460 kind of coming up on my screen, 485 00:34:54,460 --> 00:34:59,180 "Julian Assange's legal team asks for your protection." 486 00:34:59,180 --> 00:35:01,220 And I immediately had this reaction of, 487 00:35:01,220 --> 00:35:02,580 "No, I'm not gonna get into this." 488 00:35:02,580 --> 00:35:07,740 But this reaction was not based on an objective evaluation, 489 00:35:07,740 --> 00:35:10,340 and I have to admit today, to my shame, 490 00:35:10,340 --> 00:35:14,340 it was just an emotional reaction based on prejudice 491 00:35:14,340 --> 00:35:17,140 that I had in myself I wasn't even aware of. 492 00:35:18,180 --> 00:35:21,060 Why am I admitting to my prejudice? 493 00:35:21,060 --> 00:35:23,020 Because I think 494 00:35:23,020 --> 00:35:25,540 all of us had them at some point, maybe. 495 00:35:25,540 --> 00:35:28,540 All of us who had not been in personal contact 496 00:35:28,540 --> 00:35:30,420 with Julian Assange 497 00:35:30,420 --> 00:35:32,620 have been affected by this, 498 00:35:32,620 --> 00:35:34,820 because this is the public narrative 499 00:35:34,820 --> 00:35:37,900 that has been spread in the media for 10 years, 500 00:35:37,900 --> 00:35:40,660 and no-one has been able to 501 00:35:40,660 --> 00:35:45,180 actually see how much deception there is. 502 00:35:45,180 --> 00:35:47,900 Why is this being done? 503 00:35:47,900 --> 00:35:53,380 For 10 years, all of us have only focused on Julian Assange, 504 00:35:53,380 --> 00:35:56,300 when he never wanted it to be about him. 505 00:35:56,300 --> 00:35:58,740 It never WAS about him. 506 00:35:58,740 --> 00:36:00,940 It was about the States 507 00:36:00,940 --> 00:36:04,140 and their war crimes and their corruption. 508 00:36:04,140 --> 00:36:07,580 That's what HE wanted to put the spotlight on. 509 00:36:07,580 --> 00:36:09,660 And he did. 510 00:36:09,660 --> 00:36:11,220 And that's what made them angry. 511 00:36:11,220 --> 00:36:13,420 They put the spotlight on him. 512 00:36:25,980 --> 00:36:28,220 JOHN: You know, over the last 10 years, 513 00:36:28,220 --> 00:36:31,020 journalists, for some reason or other, 514 00:36:31,020 --> 00:36:37,660 have seen fit to service the government's attacks on Julian 515 00:36:37,660 --> 00:36:39,940 at the collapse of their own self-interest 516 00:36:39,940 --> 00:36:42,300 and their stature. 517 00:36:43,340 --> 00:36:48,340 After so many years of smearing and lobbying, 518 00:36:48,340 --> 00:36:51,100 this is... a good sign, 519 00:36:51,100 --> 00:36:52,420 that the newspapers... 520 00:36:53,820 --> 00:36:58,140 ..realise that the extradition of Julian Assange 521 00:36:58,140 --> 00:37:01,060 and the destruction of WikiLeaks 522 00:37:01,060 --> 00:37:04,820 is the collapse of THEIR power. 523 00:37:06,780 --> 00:37:11,780 The mass media serves only power and money, really. 524 00:37:11,780 --> 00:37:18,900 Each outlet serves a different cohort of the society. 525 00:37:18,900 --> 00:37:21,140 That's their function. 526 00:37:21,140 --> 00:37:25,300 And if they drift from that, then they will no longer exist. 527 00:37:28,100 --> 00:37:32,660 WOMAN: 'In 1971, Ellsberg was a high-level Pentagon analyst 528 00:37:32,660 --> 00:37:34,540 'when he leaked a top-secret report 529 00:37:34,540 --> 00:37:36,340 'on US involvement in Vietnam 530 00:37:36,340 --> 00:37:38,540 'that became known as the Pentagon Papers, 531 00:37:38,540 --> 00:37:41,940 'which documented how officials had lied to the public about the war.' 532 00:37:41,940 --> 00:37:44,860 If Julian is extradited to the United States 533 00:37:44,860 --> 00:37:46,580 to face these charges, 534 00:37:46,580 --> 00:37:50,020 he will be the first journalist and publisher, 535 00:37:50,020 --> 00:37:51,540 but not the last. 536 00:37:51,540 --> 00:37:53,860 New York Times probably won't be the second either. 537 00:37:53,860 --> 00:37:56,580 It might be the third or the fourth. 538 00:37:56,580 --> 00:37:59,300 Really, the American press has remained 539 00:37:59,300 --> 00:38:02,180 in kind of a state of denial for 40 years, really, 540 00:38:02,180 --> 00:38:04,020 since my case, 541 00:38:04,020 --> 00:38:06,460 that the Espionage Act has wording in it 542 00:38:06,460 --> 00:38:08,460 that could be aimed directly at them, 543 00:38:08,460 --> 00:38:10,660 at the journalists and publishers, 544 00:38:10,660 --> 00:38:13,540 although until this case, it hasn't done so. 545 00:38:13,540 --> 00:38:16,020 So the stakes here are enormous, 546 00:38:16,020 --> 00:38:19,900 and for freedom of the press all over the world, in this. 547 00:38:19,900 --> 00:38:22,100 PROTESTERS: Free Assange! MAN: Free! Free! 548 00:38:22,100 --> 00:38:24,260 Free Assange! Free! Free! 549 00:38:24,260 --> 00:38:25,620 Free Assange! 550 00:38:25,620 --> 00:38:28,060 Free! Free! Free Assange! 551 00:38:28,060 --> 00:38:30,620 WOMAN: Julian Assange is preparing to head to court, 552 00:38:30,620 --> 00:38:33,060 where a hearing will begin into whether he'll be extradited 553 00:38:33,060 --> 00:38:34,140 to the United States. 554 00:38:34,140 --> 00:38:37,660 Protesters have marched across Central London, 555 00:38:37,660 --> 00:38:42,020 calling on Britain to reject the WikiLeaks founder's deportation. 556 00:38:42,020 --> 00:38:45,060 JOHN: Thanks for waiting, ladies and gentlemen. 557 00:38:45,060 --> 00:38:47,300 What's at stake? 558 00:38:47,300 --> 00:38:50,420 For Julian, his life. 559 00:38:50,420 --> 00:38:51,860 For you guys... 560 00:38:53,380 --> 00:38:58,380 ..any prestige that you can gather, as a journalist, 561 00:38:58,380 --> 00:38:59,900 protects you. 562 00:38:59,900 --> 00:39:01,820 So this'll be the end. 563 00:39:01,820 --> 00:39:04,460 Nobody, ever again, 564 00:39:04,460 --> 00:39:06,820 will be able to get the assistance 565 00:39:06,820 --> 00:39:12,100 of 100,000 people worldwide to defend them, 566 00:39:12,100 --> 00:39:14,140 100 lawyers, 567 00:39:14,140 --> 00:39:16,540 six jurisdictions, 568 00:39:16,540 --> 00:39:19,340 in order to defend Julian Assange. 569 00:39:20,580 --> 00:39:22,540 It'll never happen again. 570 00:39:22,540 --> 00:39:25,700 If he goes down, so will journalism. 571 00:39:25,700 --> 00:39:28,060 APPLAUSE Thank you. Thank you. 572 00:39:28,060 --> 00:39:30,420 Thank you very much. Thank you. 573 00:39:30,420 --> 00:39:33,380 Can we get one? Yeah. Yeah. Oh, yeah. OK. 574 00:39:33,380 --> 00:39:35,460 Everybody... we're here... 575 00:39:35,460 --> 00:39:37,620 We're here until everybody's satisfied. 576 00:39:37,620 --> 00:39:39,060 Yeah. Perfect. 577 00:39:39,060 --> 00:39:40,740 WOMAN: How does it feel to be the father 578 00:39:40,740 --> 00:39:42,940 of such a controversial figure, 579 00:39:42,940 --> 00:39:44,700 somebody who's known around the world? 580 00:39:44,700 --> 00:39:48,340 Well, I don't see Julian, myself, as controversial. 581 00:39:48,340 --> 00:39:51,100 I see him as a... a good man. 582 00:39:51,100 --> 00:39:54,500 I support Julian Assange because he's my son, 583 00:39:54,500 --> 00:39:56,780 and this is what a father does 584 00:39:56,780 --> 00:40:00,980 when their children are in difficulty or in trouble. 585 00:40:00,980 --> 00:40:02,220 We are... 586 00:40:03,500 --> 00:40:07,700 ..very trusting of our governments, 587 00:40:07,700 --> 00:40:10,020 because we believe we elect them. 588 00:40:10,020 --> 00:40:13,300 And I'm sure that governments all over the world 589 00:40:13,300 --> 00:40:15,740 will begin to realise 590 00:40:15,740 --> 00:40:19,260 that they're faced with a tremendous credibility gap. 591 00:40:19,260 --> 00:40:22,180 Just want to shake your hand. Thank you for Julian, honestly. 592 00:40:22,180 --> 00:40:23,580 Thank you. Thank you. 593 00:40:23,580 --> 00:40:25,660 You've done a really good job. 594 00:40:25,660 --> 00:40:26,780 So proud. Thank you. 595 00:40:26,780 --> 00:40:28,980 Could I just do a quick...? I can't do 15 minutes. 596 00:40:28,980 --> 00:40:31,940 No, you can't. I know. OK. We'll just be... I'll be five. 597 00:40:31,940 --> 00:40:33,140 I'll be dead. 598 00:40:33,140 --> 00:40:35,780 My name's Fionn O Lochlainn. Fionn. Fionn. 599 00:40:35,780 --> 00:40:37,260 Fionn O Lochlainn. OK. 600 00:40:37,260 --> 00:40:40,020 My first album is called Spawn Of The Beast. 601 00:40:40,020 --> 00:40:42,540 I should have been on that stage today, 602 00:40:42,540 --> 00:40:43,620 but for some reason, 603 00:40:43,620 --> 00:40:45,540 your organisation won't get in touch with me. 604 00:40:45,540 --> 00:40:47,020 It's not MY organisation. 605 00:40:47,020 --> 00:40:48,860 I'm not even in it! Of course. 606 00:40:48,860 --> 00:40:51,420 WOMAN: ..seconds. WOMAN 2: Sorry. I'm so sorry. 607 00:40:51,420 --> 00:40:53,660 Just please let him know when you see him tomorrow 608 00:40:53,660 --> 00:40:55,420 there are many people from Australia, 609 00:40:55,420 --> 00:40:57,900 me being one of them, that are deeply thinking of him. 610 00:40:57,900 --> 00:40:58,900 Go? 611 00:40:58,900 --> 00:41:01,740 My name is John Shipton. I'm Julian Assange's father. 612 00:41:01,740 --> 00:41:05,660 I've come to the rally here today in Parliament Square. 613 00:41:05,660 --> 00:41:09,820 Yeah, let's sit down. I mean, I'm fuckin' worn out, you know? 614 00:41:13,380 --> 00:41:15,460 MAN: Britain enters lockdown. 615 00:41:15,460 --> 00:41:19,700 Now people can only leave their homes for very limited reasons. 616 00:41:19,700 --> 00:41:21,860 From this evening, I must give the British people 617 00:41:21,860 --> 00:41:23,700 a very simple instruction. 618 00:41:23,700 --> 00:41:25,900 You must stay at home. 619 00:41:25,900 --> 00:41:28,540 That is the critical thing we must do 620 00:41:28,540 --> 00:41:32,700 to stop the disease spreading between households. 621 00:41:44,340 --> 00:41:46,420 WOMAN: The Australian Parliament 622 00:41:46,420 --> 00:41:48,900 have called on British officials and the judge 623 00:41:48,900 --> 00:41:50,660 to release Julian Assange 624 00:41:50,660 --> 00:41:52,540 due to the rapid spread of coronavirus 625 00:41:52,540 --> 00:41:54,060 among the prison population 626 00:41:54,060 --> 00:41:56,220 and the workers at Belmarsh Prison, 627 00:41:56,220 --> 00:41:57,700 where Assange is being held 628 00:41:57,700 --> 00:42:01,620 23 and a half hours a day in a solitary-confinement cell. 629 00:42:01,620 --> 00:42:04,900 Yeah. OK. Yeah. OK. Yeah, all right. 630 00:42:04,900 --> 00:42:06,780 I just... you know, 631 00:42:06,780 --> 00:42:09,020 I've got the young family back in Australia 632 00:42:09,020 --> 00:42:10,900 I haven't seen now for months. 633 00:42:10,900 --> 00:42:12,900 So that's a bit awkward. 634 00:42:12,900 --> 00:42:17,660 And Julian's now 23 hours a day in the cell, 635 00:42:17,660 --> 00:42:19,660 because it's locked down, 636 00:42:19,660 --> 00:42:21,540 and half the staff are off 637 00:42:21,540 --> 00:42:23,260 because they're all sick with COVID 638 00:42:23,260 --> 00:42:26,100 or too frightened to come to work. 639 00:42:26,100 --> 00:42:28,460 The jail's in lockdown. 640 00:42:28,460 --> 00:42:31,060 I don't know how they're getting papers 641 00:42:31,060 --> 00:42:32,580 backward and forward. 642 00:42:32,580 --> 00:42:38,100 They say that they have only had one hour with Julian 643 00:42:38,100 --> 00:42:40,220 in five weeks. 644 00:42:45,100 --> 00:42:48,060 "According to prosecutors..." Yeah. 645 00:42:48,060 --> 00:42:51,260 This is why we need you on bail. 646 00:42:51,260 --> 00:42:52,780 We need... Yeah. 647 00:42:52,780 --> 00:42:55,380 I mean, I... I can't see how we can possibly... 648 00:42:58,740 --> 00:43:01,900 ..prepare a defence on these fucking phones that are... 649 00:43:01,900 --> 00:43:03,900 Anyway. 650 00:43:03,900 --> 00:43:06,820 "According to prosecutors, Assange obtained evidence... 651 00:43:06,820 --> 00:43:08,220 "..access to..." Sorry. 652 00:43:09,220 --> 00:43:10,900 You have to call me back. 653 00:43:12,260 --> 00:43:13,780 Call me back. 654 00:43:15,580 --> 00:43:19,140 JOHN: Did you hear the story I sent you? 655 00:43:19,140 --> 00:43:21,220 SEVERINE: 'No.' 656 00:43:21,220 --> 00:43:25,260 It's about the Snoceros and Rapunzel. 657 00:43:25,260 --> 00:43:27,180 SNIFFS 658 00:43:27,180 --> 00:43:30,260 And Jill and Princess Mouse. 659 00:43:30,260 --> 00:43:34,780 'Do you want to talk to me all day or... 660 00:43:34,780 --> 00:43:38,700 'would you... Or have a little rest?' 661 00:43:38,700 --> 00:43:41,220 I want to talk to you forever. 662 00:43:41,220 --> 00:43:45,660 No! I can't talk forever. I need to eat food. 663 00:43:45,660 --> 00:43:48,460 OK. All right. 664 00:43:48,460 --> 00:43:51,340 I'll talk to you tomorrow, then. 665 00:43:51,340 --> 00:43:53,940 How do we communicate this to Julian? 666 00:43:53,940 --> 00:43:55,220 Because... 667 00:43:55,220 --> 00:43:59,460 we're 10 days away from the evidence deadline. 668 00:43:59,460 --> 00:44:02,780 We can't give him documents. We can't go to see him. 669 00:44:02,780 --> 00:44:06,500 Basically, what we'll have to do is we'll have to read out 670 00:44:06,500 --> 00:44:08,900 this 49-page document over the phone. 671 00:44:08,900 --> 00:44:11,300 He can't even take notes on a laptop, 672 00:44:11,300 --> 00:44:13,500 because he doesn't have a laptop. 673 00:44:15,500 --> 00:44:17,180 Hi. 674 00:44:17,180 --> 00:44:18,740 Yeah. 675 00:44:18,740 --> 00:44:23,660 Anyway, that's where I work to fit in, 676 00:44:23,660 --> 00:44:26,140 as I'm an old man, and I... You know. 677 00:44:26,140 --> 00:44:27,700 Um... JULIAN: 'Yeah.' 678 00:44:31,700 --> 00:44:33,180 OK. OK. 679 00:44:33,180 --> 00:44:37,860 Your question to my answers always gets a raised eyebrow. 680 00:44:37,860 --> 00:44:39,380 'Yes.' 681 00:44:39,380 --> 00:44:41,300 'Yeah. Yeah.' 682 00:44:44,460 --> 00:44:45,940 Was that him on the phone before? 683 00:44:45,940 --> 00:44:47,780 Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. 684 00:44:47,780 --> 00:44:51,460 What are you talking about on a kind of regular basis? 685 00:44:51,460 --> 00:44:53,380 What sort of things? 686 00:44:57,980 --> 00:44:59,460 'Mmm. 687 00:44:59,460 --> 00:45:04,060 'I think it must be nearly 11 years since Julian... 688 00:45:04,060 --> 00:45:07,500 'was in the company of a tree or a plant... 689 00:45:08,860 --> 00:45:12,100 '..or a caterpillar or a butterfly, and... 690 00:45:12,100 --> 00:45:14,420 'So he asked me, you know, 691 00:45:14,420 --> 00:45:16,100 'did we have a walk in the forest?' 692 00:45:16,100 --> 00:45:17,700 LAUGHS 693 00:45:17,700 --> 00:45:20,180 'And, yeah, it was pleasant enough.' 694 00:45:20,180 --> 00:45:22,100 'It's a sunny day out here. 695 00:45:23,100 --> 00:45:25,660 'Bonding, I suppose, you know, 696 00:45:25,660 --> 00:45:28,540 'when walking with his family and so on, yeah. 697 00:45:32,220 --> 00:45:37,180 'I think if you applied you know, your understanding 698 00:45:37,180 --> 00:45:39,740 'to what it would be like 699 00:45:39,740 --> 00:45:43,460 'to live in a room for seven and a half years... 700 00:45:45,220 --> 00:45:48,260 'You'd just know every nook and cranny and... 701 00:45:48,260 --> 00:45:50,260 'Ugh. 702 00:45:50,260 --> 00:45:53,660 'Everything would be familiar with. And it's still ongoing.' 703 00:45:53,660 --> 00:45:57,260 So, yeah, the challenge is to make him laugh, you know, 704 00:45:57,260 --> 00:45:59,820 when he...rings up. 705 00:45:59,820 --> 00:46:02,500 Which I do, you know? 706 00:46:22,660 --> 00:46:25,660 WOMAN: A happy family relaxing in a London park, 707 00:46:25,660 --> 00:46:28,220 but there's a hole at the heart of it. 708 00:46:28,220 --> 00:46:30,500 Stella Moris was part of Assange's legal team 709 00:46:30,500 --> 00:46:32,060 before she got engaged to him. 710 00:46:32,060 --> 00:46:34,500 Today, Stella will be at the Old Bailey 711 00:46:34,500 --> 00:46:37,140 for the start of up to four weeks of legal arguments 712 00:46:37,140 --> 00:46:40,340 over whether her fiance should be extradited to America. 713 00:46:40,340 --> 00:46:42,820 Julian hasn't seen his lawyers for six months. 714 00:46:42,820 --> 00:46:45,020 The first day that he'll have seen his lawyers 715 00:46:45,020 --> 00:46:46,540 will be today. 716 00:46:46,540 --> 00:46:48,820 SPEAKS SWEDISH 717 00:46:51,780 --> 00:46:53,260 CHILD CRIES 718 00:46:53,260 --> 00:46:55,020 Bye, sweetie. 719 00:46:56,300 --> 00:46:59,500 SPEAKS SWEDISH 720 00:47:03,420 --> 00:47:05,620 Julian Assange is in our headlines. 721 00:47:05,620 --> 00:47:07,460 He's in a London courtroom this morning 722 00:47:07,460 --> 00:47:09,620 finally facing an extradition hearing. 723 00:47:09,620 --> 00:47:11,860 The court is to decide if Assange 724 00:47:11,860 --> 00:47:14,740 should be extradited to the United States 725 00:47:14,740 --> 00:47:18,060 to face a trial over the publication of secrets. 726 00:47:18,060 --> 00:47:20,420 MAN: The Trump administration wants the Australian 727 00:47:20,420 --> 00:47:22,500 to face charges of espionage. 728 00:47:22,500 --> 00:47:26,060 Legal observers say it's an unprecedented breach 729 00:47:26,060 --> 00:47:28,140 of US free speech protections. 730 00:47:28,140 --> 00:47:30,940 The US Department of Justice is going after him 731 00:47:30,940 --> 00:47:33,900 under a different law now - the Espionage Act. 732 00:47:33,900 --> 00:47:36,340 That law has been used against whistle-blowers before, 733 00:47:36,340 --> 00:47:38,940 but never against a publisher. 734 00:47:38,940 --> 00:47:40,940 WOMAN: We've never in this country 735 00:47:40,940 --> 00:47:44,300 successfully charged somebody for publishing secret material. 736 00:47:44,300 --> 00:47:47,020 There is a reason - it's called the First Amendment - 737 00:47:47,020 --> 00:47:48,380 that the US government 738 00:47:48,380 --> 00:47:50,700 has never successfully made that a crime before. 739 00:47:50,700 --> 00:47:54,020 But here, with Assange, they are trying to do it. 740 00:47:54,020 --> 00:47:56,940 If Assange's publishing of classified information 741 00:47:56,940 --> 00:47:58,660 runs afoul of the law, 742 00:47:58,660 --> 00:48:02,300 so does the work of just about every single serious press outlet, 743 00:48:02,300 --> 00:48:03,860 this one included. 744 00:48:03,860 --> 00:48:05,900 The First Amendment protects the basic right 745 00:48:05,900 --> 00:48:08,460 of a free press - and a free people - 746 00:48:08,460 --> 00:48:12,020 to publish truthful information about matters of public import, 747 00:48:12,020 --> 00:48:13,820 whether the government likes it or not. 748 00:48:13,820 --> 00:48:16,260 SHOUTING 749 00:48:24,060 --> 00:48:25,540 All good? 750 00:48:33,300 --> 00:48:34,700 Morning, John. Good morning. 751 00:48:34,700 --> 00:48:36,700 Good morning. Good to see you. 752 00:48:36,700 --> 00:48:38,900 Good morning, Stella. 753 00:48:38,900 --> 00:48:41,900 Please move, please! 754 00:48:41,900 --> 00:48:43,860 Please. Move round these people. 755 00:48:43,860 --> 00:48:46,300 Let the ladies through, please. 756 00:48:46,300 --> 00:48:48,820 Free Julian Assange! 757 00:48:48,820 --> 00:48:51,820 When did you last speak to him and see him face-to-face? 758 00:48:51,820 --> 00:48:55,140 Six months ago, when COVID locked down. 759 00:48:55,140 --> 00:48:57,100 They're not allowed to see anybody. 760 00:48:57,100 --> 00:48:59,300 Have you seen him today? 761 00:48:59,300 --> 00:49:01,180 Only in the glass box. Oh, OK. 762 00:49:01,180 --> 00:49:03,340 Yeah. Yeah. And how is he? 763 00:49:03,340 --> 00:49:05,540 Uh... is he... 764 00:49:05,540 --> 00:49:07,540 I can't answer that. How do I know? 765 00:49:07,540 --> 00:49:10,860 I was sitting upstairs. He's in the glass box downstairs. 766 00:49:10,860 --> 00:49:14,340 I would love to go and see him, but it's not allowed. 767 00:49:14,340 --> 00:49:15,860 I'll bring you a coffee here. 768 00:49:15,860 --> 00:49:17,860 I'm going to go and have a coffee. 769 00:49:17,860 --> 00:49:20,340 Yeah. I... I met you and I know you. 770 00:49:20,340 --> 00:49:22,540 I have to go. I have to go. I have to look after... 771 00:49:22,540 --> 00:49:24,020 Can I ask one question for the news? 772 00:49:24,020 --> 00:49:25,940 No. No. No! I just did 10 questions. 773 00:49:25,940 --> 00:49:27,300 You have to come to this... 774 00:49:27,300 --> 00:49:29,180 Thank you so much for this. Thank you. 775 00:49:29,180 --> 00:49:31,500 Free Julian Assange! I'm done. I'm done. I'm done. 776 00:49:31,500 --> 00:49:34,340 Just one thing. I'm done. 777 00:49:34,340 --> 00:49:36,780 PROTESTERS SHOUT 778 00:49:36,780 --> 00:49:38,300 Oh, dear. 779 00:49:42,860 --> 00:49:43,900 Yeah. Oh, yes. 780 00:49:47,020 --> 00:49:48,060 Well, you know... 781 00:49:49,380 --> 00:49:50,540 Thank you. 782 00:49:52,940 --> 00:49:53,980 Oh, you... you... Yeah? 783 00:49:53,980 --> 00:49:56,180 If you were fighting for your kids, you would. 784 00:49:56,180 --> 00:49:57,860 Yeah. I... I hope so. 785 00:50:00,460 --> 00:50:01,980 Bit scared. 786 00:50:05,700 --> 00:50:07,020 MAN: Scared? 787 00:50:07,020 --> 00:50:08,620 Running out of juice. 788 00:50:17,100 --> 00:50:20,700 MAN: But Julian Assange, right now, today, 789 00:50:20,700 --> 00:50:21,780 is in court in the UK, 790 00:50:21,780 --> 00:50:24,060 fighting an extradition trial to the United States. 791 00:50:24,060 --> 00:50:27,340 Now, he really fell out of favour in 2016 792 00:50:27,340 --> 00:50:29,340 because he published the Hillary emails 793 00:50:29,340 --> 00:50:32,140 and everything like that, or Podesta emails. 794 00:50:32,140 --> 00:50:34,940 But he's not being charged for that. 795 00:50:34,940 --> 00:50:37,700 The extradition trial has nothing to do with that. 796 00:50:37,700 --> 00:50:41,580 Actually, the US government is trying to extradite this guy 797 00:50:41,580 --> 00:50:44,220 and put him in prison for the rest of his life 798 00:50:44,220 --> 00:50:47,140 for the BEST work that WikiLeaks ever did, 799 00:50:47,140 --> 00:50:50,980 which is the Iraq and Afghanistan War logs, right? 800 00:50:50,980 --> 00:50:54,740 Detainee records in Guantanamo Bay. 801 00:50:54,740 --> 00:50:58,780 Things that are about explicit war crimes and abuses of power. 802 00:50:58,780 --> 00:51:01,660 JOE ROGAN: There's many things that are disturbing about this case, 803 00:51:01,660 --> 00:51:03,620 but another thing that's been disturbing was, 804 00:51:03,620 --> 00:51:07,940 he was a guy who the left supported up until 2016, 805 00:51:07,940 --> 00:51:09,580 and then it became inconvenient. 806 00:51:09,580 --> 00:51:12,260 EDWARD SNOWDEN: When he was dragging Bush, it was great. 807 00:51:12,260 --> 00:51:13,700 Then when he's dragging... Yes! 808 00:51:13,700 --> 00:51:15,100 ..Clinton, it's not so great. 809 00:51:15,100 --> 00:51:17,100 He was the darling of the left. 810 00:51:17,100 --> 00:51:19,660 I mean, they were all, "Free Julian Assange." 811 00:51:19,660 --> 00:51:21,380 And it's so interesting 812 00:51:21,380 --> 00:51:24,940 how that narrative can shift so completely, 813 00:51:24,940 --> 00:51:28,220 to, all of a sudden, he's a puppet of Russia. 814 00:51:28,220 --> 00:51:31,940 It's amazing how that kind of propaganda, 815 00:51:31,940 --> 00:51:34,500 when you just get at the surface veneer 816 00:51:34,500 --> 00:51:36,860 of whatever the narrative they're trying to push, 817 00:51:36,860 --> 00:51:38,580 how well it spreads. 818 00:51:41,700 --> 00:51:45,540 Snowden was across the material really well. 819 00:51:45,540 --> 00:51:46,580 Yeah. 820 00:51:48,180 --> 00:51:50,340 One second, John. Yeah. 821 00:51:50,340 --> 00:51:51,860 What happened today, John? 822 00:51:51,860 --> 00:51:54,980 It was a very strong day for the defence. 823 00:51:54,980 --> 00:51:58,020 There's nobody, in the last 10 years, 824 00:51:58,020 --> 00:52:02,540 been harmed when the files were released, 825 00:52:02,540 --> 00:52:06,820 and all of the cables, 15,000 cables, were redacted, 826 00:52:06,820 --> 00:52:10,420 so overall, the intensity of the week 827 00:52:10,420 --> 00:52:13,940 is demonstrating the thoroughness of redactions 828 00:52:13,940 --> 00:52:19,540 and the care for people and treasuring and cherishing life. 829 00:52:33,060 --> 00:52:34,740 We've covered... OK. 830 00:52:34,740 --> 00:52:37,060 ..the case for a long, long time. So... 831 00:52:37,060 --> 00:52:39,660 OK. OK. ..an update from you... 832 00:52:39,660 --> 00:52:41,500 Here's John. Hi. How are you? 833 00:52:41,500 --> 00:52:42,900 Hi. Nice to meet you. 834 00:52:42,900 --> 00:52:44,020 Keir? Keir. Yeah. 835 00:52:44,020 --> 00:52:45,100 Keir? Oh. Yeah. 836 00:52:45,100 --> 00:52:49,300 Your son is somebody that everybody thinks they know 837 00:52:49,300 --> 00:52:51,620 and has an opinion about. 838 00:52:51,620 --> 00:52:53,620 But he's YOUR son. 839 00:52:53,620 --> 00:52:55,220 JOHN SHIPTON: Yep. Must be... 840 00:52:55,220 --> 00:52:58,100 Generally... Generally, I don't... 841 00:52:58,100 --> 00:53:02,620 Yeah, I keep away from commentary about Julian. 842 00:53:02,620 --> 00:53:07,020 Do you think that he has been naive at times? 843 00:53:07,020 --> 00:53:08,660 Naive? 844 00:53:08,660 --> 00:53:15,260 Expecting states to obey their own laws is hardly naive. 845 00:53:15,260 --> 00:53:18,260 Are you proud of what he did there? 846 00:53:18,260 --> 00:53:22,540 I'm proud of his endurance and courage, intelligence. 847 00:53:22,540 --> 00:53:25,380 Do you think that Julian is a journalist? 848 00:53:26,540 --> 00:53:28,180 Well, of course. 849 00:53:28,180 --> 00:53:33,860 He now has, I think it's 26 journalism awards. 850 00:53:33,860 --> 00:53:35,460 And what are your worst fears? 851 00:53:38,060 --> 00:53:39,500 That he... 852 00:53:41,140 --> 00:53:45,100 ..that he just collapses under the strain, I mean, yeah. 853 00:53:46,420 --> 00:53:49,260 Yeah. Good. Good? Yeah. WOMAN: Mm-hm. 854 00:53:49,260 --> 00:53:50,660 Great. WOMAN: Yep. 855 00:53:50,660 --> 00:53:52,420 We'll need a walk-in shot, if that's OK. 856 00:53:52,420 --> 00:53:54,060 Do you need a shot of them... There's a... 857 00:53:54,060 --> 00:53:56,980 ..standing by, one listening to the other? 858 00:53:59,500 --> 00:54:02,780 JOHN SHIPTON: Listen, why don't you people wind this up? 859 00:54:02,780 --> 00:54:04,540 You must do... 860 00:54:08,460 --> 00:54:11,420 Oh, yeah, OK. Sorry. Just wondering. 861 00:54:11,420 --> 00:54:12,860 Worried about your crew? Yeah. 862 00:54:12,860 --> 00:54:14,900 Like, he's looking at the computer. 863 00:54:14,900 --> 00:54:17,060 He should be over here winding you up 864 00:54:17,060 --> 00:54:18,620 and saying, "You've had enough." 865 00:54:20,180 --> 00:54:23,140 MAN: Did you feel that interview was too soft? 866 00:54:23,140 --> 00:54:24,540 No. No? 867 00:54:24,540 --> 00:54:26,860 No, it was fine. 868 00:54:26,860 --> 00:54:28,500 Just too long. 869 00:54:29,820 --> 00:54:32,380 MAN: Will you watch things like that back, or you're not...? 870 00:54:32,380 --> 00:54:33,780 Or you just wait? 871 00:54:33,780 --> 00:54:36,500 Like, how do you monitor the interviews that you do? 872 00:54:36,500 --> 00:54:39,180 Or do you at all? Can you keep up with them now? 873 00:54:39,180 --> 00:54:42,060 Oh, I've never watched one, ever. No? 874 00:54:43,500 --> 00:54:48,500 Sometimes I listen to Seven Stories, 875 00:54:48,500 --> 00:54:51,580 to remember what the characters are doing, 876 00:54:51,580 --> 00:54:54,380 but I...I've never watched an interview. 877 00:55:00,980 --> 00:55:03,700 And why is the reason for that, for you? 878 00:55:06,140 --> 00:55:09,020 Mmm... I don't like them. LAUGHS 879 00:55:11,100 --> 00:55:13,660 I guess what I was getting at is, 880 00:55:13,660 --> 00:55:15,980 how hard are you on yourself? 881 00:55:15,980 --> 00:55:17,820 Cos such a big part of what you're doing 882 00:55:17,820 --> 00:55:19,940 is to be clearly understood. 883 00:55:24,220 --> 00:55:26,460 Well, my... 884 00:55:26,460 --> 00:55:28,620 Great-Uncle Vivian, 885 00:55:28,620 --> 00:55:30,420 he died youngish, you know, 886 00:55:30,420 --> 00:55:33,580 at 35 or 38, something like that. 887 00:55:37,180 --> 00:55:40,500 On his gravestone is the... 888 00:55:40,500 --> 00:55:43,460 his name and the date he died 889 00:55:43,460 --> 00:55:47,300 and the inscription "Not understood." 890 00:55:51,780 --> 00:55:53,620 Yeah. 891 00:56:01,940 --> 00:56:03,940 I don't much like talking about myself, 892 00:56:03,940 --> 00:56:05,580 because it's always sectional, 893 00:56:05,580 --> 00:56:08,220 and a life is really a rich thing, you know? 894 00:56:09,380 --> 00:56:12,780 But I find myself... 895 00:56:12,780 --> 00:56:14,660 distinct... 896 00:56:14,660 --> 00:56:16,660 and... 897 00:56:16,660 --> 00:56:19,300 consequently, not understood. 898 00:56:21,700 --> 00:56:23,260 You know, the more distinct you are, 899 00:56:23,260 --> 00:56:27,540 you just become more lonely, until... 900 00:56:27,540 --> 00:56:31,740 you are faced with the abomination of desolation 901 00:56:31,740 --> 00:56:34,100 and existential panic 902 00:56:34,100 --> 00:56:37,180 as you become more and more distinct, 903 00:56:37,180 --> 00:56:41,340 and so you become silent, you know? 904 00:56:42,340 --> 00:56:48,300 And this is your burden, the essence of your being. 905 00:56:49,740 --> 00:56:53,420 Situations like this, you know, erm... 906 00:56:54,820 --> 00:56:58,460 ..it's sort of an interior conflict for me. 907 00:57:00,220 --> 00:57:03,020 MAN: But if people walked away from this film 908 00:57:03,020 --> 00:57:04,820 understanding you... 909 00:57:04,820 --> 00:57:07,140 Well, got the sense of understanding you 910 00:57:07,140 --> 00:57:10,860 a little bit more deeply. 911 00:57:12,580 --> 00:57:14,860 How would you feel about that? 912 00:57:14,860 --> 00:57:20,820 Oh. Well, I'd be very grateful and moved, you know? 913 00:57:20,820 --> 00:57:24,020 That'd be nice. It'd be more than nice. 914 00:57:24,020 --> 00:57:25,420 But... 915 00:57:27,220 --> 00:57:30,660 We're here, and this has only come about 916 00:57:30,660 --> 00:57:33,180 because we have a problem, you know? 917 00:57:33,180 --> 00:57:34,820 We have a child in the shit. 918 00:57:34,820 --> 00:57:36,260 Mmm. And... 919 00:57:37,580 --> 00:57:39,060 ..I want to get him out. 920 00:57:43,180 --> 00:57:45,940 The energies aren't with me. 921 00:57:45,940 --> 00:57:47,940 It's not John Shipton, you know? 922 00:57:47,940 --> 00:57:51,020 The energies are with US and the, 923 00:57:51,020 --> 00:57:54,940 you know, "Cometh the hour, cometh the man." 924 00:57:54,940 --> 00:57:58,940 The Greeks always say, "Of gods, there are many. 925 00:57:58,940 --> 00:58:01,700 "Of men, there are few." 926 00:58:01,700 --> 00:58:02,940 Mmm. 927 00:58:02,940 --> 00:58:05,140 You'll give it to somebody... 928 00:58:05,140 --> 00:58:08,580 I bought them because Ai Weiwei was here today. 929 00:58:08,580 --> 00:58:10,940 And he's a man of peace. Yeah, yeah. 930 00:58:10,940 --> 00:58:13,460 Now, come on. 931 00:58:13,460 --> 00:58:15,700 You're always cranky. You have to have a flower. 932 00:58:15,700 --> 00:58:18,140 Cranky? Me? JOHN LAUGHS 933 00:58:22,100 --> 00:58:24,500 Good morning. Good morning. 934 00:58:24,500 --> 00:58:25,620 How are you? 935 00:58:25,620 --> 00:58:27,660 It's good to see you. You look well. 936 00:58:27,660 --> 00:58:29,420 Huh? You look well. 937 00:58:29,420 --> 00:58:31,620 You look well. I...Yeah. 938 00:58:33,820 --> 00:58:35,780 Yeah. We...we go in together. 939 00:58:37,420 --> 00:58:39,340 Yes. Yeah. 940 00:58:39,340 --> 00:58:40,380 OK. 941 00:58:44,740 --> 00:58:45,940 Yes. 942 00:58:48,900 --> 00:58:49,940 Yes. 943 00:58:52,140 --> 00:58:56,340 No. No. Yeah. Yeah. In the fight. Yeah. Yep. 944 00:58:56,340 --> 00:58:57,780 Yep. 945 00:58:59,940 --> 00:59:01,260 WOMAN: Why do you think 946 00:59:01,260 --> 00:59:03,940 there's not a great public love of Mr Assange? 947 00:59:24,380 --> 00:59:25,740 MAN: Yeah, yeah, yeah. 948 00:59:51,700 --> 00:59:53,660 SIREN WAILS, SHOUTING 949 00:59:53,660 --> 00:59:55,660 Oh, God. Here we go. 950 00:59:57,500 --> 00:59:59,700 I don't like to start too early, 951 00:59:59,700 --> 01:00:02,020 but what can you do? 952 01:00:02,020 --> 01:00:04,340 INDISTINCT SHOUTING 953 01:00:07,580 --> 01:00:11,380 Well, the big ones were the dispute over sentencing. 954 01:00:11,380 --> 01:00:14,340 Then they went on to the sort of jail 955 01:00:14,340 --> 01:00:16,500 that Julian would be held in 956 01:00:16,500 --> 01:00:18,740 and the conditions in the jail. 957 01:00:18,740 --> 01:00:22,740 One of the wardens did go as much to say 958 01:00:22,740 --> 01:00:27,420 that time in his jail is worse than death. 959 01:00:27,420 --> 01:00:29,540 MAN: Thank you very much, John. Thank you. 960 01:00:43,780 --> 01:00:45,620 MAN: Supermax is life after death. 961 01:00:45,620 --> 01:00:48,340 It adds punishment to the crime. 962 01:00:48,340 --> 01:00:51,100 Today, there's 420 inmates in the prison. 963 01:00:51,100 --> 01:00:53,060 They've killed staff. They've killed guards. 964 01:00:53,060 --> 01:00:56,260 They've earned, if you will, the right to go to supermax. 965 01:00:56,260 --> 01:01:00,060 You're designing it so the inmates can't see the sky, intentionally. 966 01:01:00,060 --> 01:01:03,780 And it's far... much worse than death. 967 01:01:05,140 --> 01:01:11,940 So today, the three days of medical evidence begins. 968 01:01:11,940 --> 01:01:14,580 It will start with... 969 01:01:14,580 --> 01:01:18,060 the US will try to argue that... 970 01:01:18,060 --> 01:01:20,700 yes, that he has, um... 971 01:01:23,180 --> 01:01:24,820 ..mental health problems, 972 01:01:24,820 --> 01:01:29,900 but that these can be managed in the US setting. 973 01:01:29,900 --> 01:01:31,420 Um... 974 01:01:31,420 --> 01:01:36,500 So it kind of dovetails with the US prison conditions as well. 975 01:01:36,500 --> 01:01:39,100 When I was speaking to Julian yesterday, 976 01:01:39,100 --> 01:01:41,460 he said, "They're burgling my mind, 977 01:01:41,460 --> 01:01:45,940 "and they're doing it in a judicial setting." 978 01:01:45,940 --> 01:01:47,220 MAN: And, John, 979 01:01:47,220 --> 01:01:50,460 did this psychological cross-examination of Julian's... 980 01:01:52,340 --> 01:01:54,380 ..state at the moment, was this something that... 981 01:01:54,380 --> 01:01:58,540 that you had a similar feeling towards? 982 01:02:00,340 --> 01:02:03,380 Oh, in some senses, I don't think it matters much. 983 01:02:03,380 --> 01:02:05,020 There's so... 984 01:02:07,420 --> 01:02:08,740 There's, er... 985 01:02:15,340 --> 01:02:20,460 So many opinions about Julian. 986 01:02:21,460 --> 01:02:23,820 It just joins them, you know... 987 01:02:25,300 --> 01:02:28,420 ..in the layer of opinions, 988 01:02:28,420 --> 01:02:30,980 that Julian's this, that or the other. 989 01:02:36,020 --> 01:02:38,540 It matters in the legal context. 990 01:02:43,860 --> 01:02:49,380 But in a...in a spiritual sense, it is...depraved... 991 01:02:51,740 --> 01:02:57,100 ..tearing the liver, over and over again, from... 992 01:02:57,100 --> 01:02:59,940 the person, the... 993 01:02:59,940 --> 01:03:05,180 that brought the gift of fire to people. 994 01:03:07,460 --> 01:03:11,260 Do you know that legend? Prometheus. 995 01:03:12,340 --> 01:03:14,460 It's extraordinary. 996 01:03:16,940 --> 01:03:19,820 Very hard to explain to people. 997 01:03:59,820 --> 01:04:02,260 SPEAKS INDISTINCTLY Yes. 998 01:04:14,060 --> 01:04:16,260 Let's go? Yep. 999 01:04:16,260 --> 01:04:19,700 Yep? Oh, gee. It was torrid today. 1000 01:04:27,740 --> 01:04:29,220 Oh. 1001 01:04:29,220 --> 01:04:32,380 Are you OK from that? Yep. 1002 01:04:41,260 --> 01:04:43,540 MAN 2: Can we talk about his health at the moment 1003 01:04:43,540 --> 01:04:45,980 and his autism diagnosis? 1004 01:04:45,980 --> 01:04:48,140 JOHN SHIPTON: I'm not interested in that. 1005 01:04:48,140 --> 01:04:50,460 He is as he is to me. 1006 01:04:50,460 --> 01:04:52,020 MAN: Yeah. Yeah. 1007 01:04:52,020 --> 01:04:55,340 Can you explain how that... 1008 01:04:55,340 --> 01:04:57,300 I have no interest in it. ..manifests itself? 1009 01:04:57,300 --> 01:04:59,900 I have no interest in it. He is as he is. 1010 01:05:02,620 --> 01:05:04,980 What do you understand of autism? What do you...? 1011 01:05:04,980 --> 01:05:06,980 Oh, I've no idea what it is. 1012 01:05:06,980 --> 01:05:10,380 You know, I don't relate really well to people myself. 1013 01:05:10,380 --> 01:05:12,540 In fact... 1014 01:05:12,540 --> 01:05:15,500 generally speaking, I... 1015 01:05:15,500 --> 01:05:22,260 I had no idea what people were like until quite late in life. 1016 01:05:22,260 --> 01:05:27,900 But I just was always throwing myself up against ideas that... 1017 01:05:27,900 --> 01:05:30,420 Well, people said I was angry, you know, 1018 01:05:30,420 --> 01:05:34,100 but I'm mild-natured, so I can't have been too angry. 1019 01:05:39,140 --> 01:05:42,180 When's your earliest memory of that occurring? 1020 01:05:42,180 --> 01:05:47,220 I suppose the earliest memory was 11 and 12, 1021 01:05:47,220 --> 01:05:51,700 writing the works of Voltaire on the blackboard 1022 01:05:51,700 --> 01:05:55,780 while everybody was...in chapel, 1023 01:05:55,780 --> 01:06:00,620 because I knew their beliefs are otherwise. 1024 01:06:03,820 --> 01:06:05,380 You know, I... 1025 01:06:05,380 --> 01:06:08,380 I think, from the age of... 1026 01:06:10,180 --> 01:06:12,100 ..15 onwards 1027 01:06:12,100 --> 01:06:14,780 suffered from varying depths of depression 1028 01:06:14,780 --> 01:06:16,900 until about 28 or 29. 1029 01:06:18,180 --> 01:06:20,700 Erm... 1030 01:06:20,700 --> 01:06:22,900 So I was pretty quiet, you know? 1031 01:06:22,900 --> 01:06:24,420 Mmm. Mmm. 1032 01:06:25,700 --> 01:06:29,220 I was a hermit for a while. That's not much fun. 1033 01:06:30,500 --> 01:06:36,940 But I found myself riddled with fractures 1034 01:06:36,940 --> 01:06:40,380 and objections and... 1035 01:06:40,380 --> 01:06:43,540 guilts and shames and... 1036 01:06:43,540 --> 01:06:47,860 all of those devilish things. 1037 01:06:51,100 --> 01:06:53,260 What brought you out of that period, then? 1038 01:06:53,260 --> 01:06:54,580 Well, I don't know. 1039 01:06:54,580 --> 01:06:57,540 You know, just... you just learn techniques 1040 01:06:57,540 --> 01:07:00,700 of how to relate to people. Yeah. 1041 01:07:00,700 --> 01:07:03,740 Also, my curiosity, you know, was boundless, 1042 01:07:03,740 --> 01:07:08,980 so I gradually discovered ways to be with people 1043 01:07:08,980 --> 01:07:14,700 without collapsing into nervous distress, erm... 1044 01:07:14,700 --> 01:07:17,780 You might say one was Aspergic 1045 01:07:17,780 --> 01:07:22,420 and, through suffering, learnt technique. 1046 01:07:22,420 --> 01:07:24,660 Mmm. You know? So... 1047 01:07:25,740 --> 01:07:30,180 I had a burning desire, still have it, 1048 01:07:30,180 --> 01:07:34,580 to be able to...to give love. 1049 01:07:34,580 --> 01:07:37,660 I just wanted to do that. I wanted to love people. 1050 01:07:39,140 --> 01:07:43,100 But people are funny creatures. 1051 01:07:43,100 --> 01:07:47,300 Erm...And in order to love them, 1052 01:07:47,300 --> 01:07:51,100 you have to find what they want, 1053 01:07:51,100 --> 01:07:54,540 how they want love to come to them. 1054 01:07:54,540 --> 01:07:59,780 And so learning that was a bit of a craft. 1055 01:08:01,300 --> 01:08:03,620 But did you feel that came easier to others than you? 1056 01:08:03,620 --> 01:08:05,100 Or is that something you sense...? 1057 01:08:05,100 --> 01:08:07,380 Oh, no, no. I don't... People don't do it. 1058 01:08:07,380 --> 01:08:09,580 You know, they only do it out of... 1059 01:08:09,580 --> 01:08:12,900 They do it as a transactional exchange, 1060 01:08:12,900 --> 01:08:15,060 that they WANT love, 1061 01:08:15,060 --> 01:08:17,180 so they give it in order to get it. 1062 01:08:18,260 --> 01:08:21,260 I just wanted to be able to... to love. 1063 01:08:21,260 --> 01:08:22,540 Mmm. Erm... 1064 01:08:23,580 --> 01:08:24,580 Yeah. 1065 01:08:27,940 --> 01:08:30,140 MAN: Have you just stepped into the film now? 1066 01:08:30,140 --> 01:08:31,300 Me? Yeah. 1067 01:08:31,300 --> 01:08:32,940 Yeah. That's... 1068 01:08:32,940 --> 01:08:35,540 This is our routine in the morning. Oh, right. 1069 01:08:35,540 --> 01:08:38,260 SHOUTING, DRUMS BEAT 1070 01:08:39,700 --> 01:08:43,460 Good morning. Good morning. Good morning. Good morning. 1071 01:08:43,460 --> 01:08:44,900 Are you well today? Good morning. 1072 01:08:44,900 --> 01:08:47,780 Yes, yes. Good morning. Well, thank you. 1073 01:08:47,780 --> 01:08:50,220 This is Gabriel, Julian's brother. 1074 01:08:50,220 --> 01:08:51,820 Hi. How are you? 1075 01:08:51,820 --> 01:08:55,260 This is Gabriel. This is Julian's brother. 1076 01:08:55,260 --> 01:08:57,420 INDISTINCT CHATTER 1077 01:08:57,420 --> 01:08:59,420 This is Gabriel, Julian's brother. 1078 01:09:01,340 --> 01:09:04,980 MAN: Julian Assange has been suffering terrible deprivation, 1079 01:09:04,980 --> 01:09:08,860 and all because he published the truth. 1080 01:09:08,860 --> 01:09:13,900 And much of that truth revealed terrible crimes - 1081 01:09:13,900 --> 01:09:17,020 war crimes and crimes against humanity, 1082 01:09:17,020 --> 01:09:19,780 and lies and corruption by government. 1083 01:09:19,780 --> 01:09:23,660 And not one of the people who committed those war crimes 1084 01:09:23,660 --> 01:09:25,980 is on trial anywhere. 1085 01:09:25,980 --> 01:09:28,260 Instead, we have the man 1086 01:09:28,260 --> 01:09:32,020 who had the courage to reveal those war crimes 1087 01:09:32,020 --> 01:09:35,260 is the one whose liberty is at stake, 1088 01:09:35,260 --> 01:09:37,620 and that is not right. 1089 01:09:37,620 --> 01:09:40,340 CHEERING AND APPLAUSE 1090 01:09:47,220 --> 01:09:50,060 I mean, I think this is an important... 1091 01:09:51,500 --> 01:09:54,020 ..process overall that you're going from... 1092 01:09:55,660 --> 01:09:57,940 ..that the criminality is not Julian. 1093 01:09:57,940 --> 01:09:59,700 Julian is, like, the... 1094 01:10:01,020 --> 01:10:02,780 ..he's the victim, right, 1095 01:10:02,780 --> 01:10:04,980 and there's all this criminality surrounding him, 1096 01:10:04,980 --> 01:10:08,260 and he's the one exposing the criminality and so on. 1097 01:10:08,260 --> 01:10:12,460 Erm...So you have to shift the... 1098 01:10:12,460 --> 01:10:15,140 perception of where the crime is. 1099 01:10:40,020 --> 01:10:41,900 MAN ON TV: ..concerned about how he will handle 1100 01:10:41,900 --> 01:10:43,180 the end of his presidency. 1101 01:10:43,180 --> 01:10:45,180 President Trump's brazen and delusional push 1102 01:10:45,180 --> 01:10:47,060 to overturn the 2020 election 1103 01:10:47,060 --> 01:10:49,260 is alarming some senior officials 1104 01:10:49,260 --> 01:10:51,180 and people close to the President, 1105 01:10:51,180 --> 01:10:54,660 who say they're concerned about how he's handling his final weeks... 1106 01:10:54,660 --> 01:10:56,420 STELLA MORIS: My parents were engaged in 1107 01:10:56,420 --> 01:10:59,140 the apartheid struggle in South Africa. 1108 01:10:59,140 --> 01:11:01,300 We were living in Botswana, 1109 01:11:01,300 --> 01:11:03,500 and, as a child, growing up, 1110 01:11:03,500 --> 01:11:06,540 we would be going to the rallies and singing the... 1111 01:11:06,540 --> 01:11:08,780 the freedom, the liberation, songs 1112 01:11:08,780 --> 01:11:12,500 and have these stories about 1113 01:11:12,500 --> 01:11:15,860 the heroes and the martyrs, I guess, 1114 01:11:15,860 --> 01:11:18,340 the ones who...who didn't survive. 1115 01:11:18,340 --> 01:11:22,540 And that kind of shaped a lot of my early years, 1116 01:11:22,540 --> 01:11:25,380 my early political education. 1117 01:11:25,380 --> 01:11:29,700 You know, there was a very clear sense of right and wrong 1118 01:11:29,700 --> 01:11:33,620 and of...clear oppression, 1119 01:11:33,620 --> 01:11:37,220 of things that were being done to good people. 1120 01:11:40,140 --> 01:11:43,020 So I studied politics and law, 1121 01:11:43,020 --> 01:11:46,700 and it was definitely because I was drawn to... 1122 01:11:46,700 --> 01:11:51,380 issues to do with justice and power, I guess. 1123 01:11:51,380 --> 01:11:53,140 Should I go for the rest? 1124 01:11:56,140 --> 01:11:58,100 Wait, wait. 1125 01:11:58,100 --> 01:11:59,620 Hold on. 1126 01:11:59,620 --> 01:12:00,900 OK. 1127 01:12:00,900 --> 01:12:04,620 So this one in Belmarsh a few minutes ago, outside Belmarsh. 1128 01:12:04,620 --> 01:12:08,500 CHOIR SINGS It's a gospel choir. 1129 01:12:08,500 --> 01:12:11,460 And they're standing outside, like, the main entrance, 1130 01:12:11,460 --> 01:12:13,660 where you're not supposed to film. 1131 01:12:14,700 --> 01:12:16,900 That's Daddy. 1132 01:12:16,900 --> 01:12:20,020 I think they sang two songs. That was Daddy. 1133 01:12:20,020 --> 01:12:23,860 Daddy. It's Daddy, isn't it? 1134 01:12:23,860 --> 01:12:26,180 CHOIR SINGS 1135 01:12:26,180 --> 01:12:28,660 My daddy. It's Daddy. 1136 01:12:28,660 --> 01:12:33,540 # Something inside so strong 1137 01:12:33,540 --> 01:12:37,100 # I know that I can make it 1138 01:12:37,100 --> 01:12:40,300 # Though you're doing me wrong So wrong 1139 01:12:40,300 --> 01:12:43,420 # You thought that My pride was gone 1140 01:12:43,420 --> 01:12:46,300 # Oh, no 1141 01:12:46,300 --> 01:12:50,180 # Something inside So strong...# 1142 01:12:57,180 --> 01:12:59,340 STELLA MORIS: Well, they're all in... 1143 01:12:59,340 --> 01:13:01,500 you know... 1144 01:13:01,500 --> 01:13:03,180 winter jackets and... 1145 01:13:10,060 --> 01:13:11,580 CHUCKLES 1146 01:13:11,580 --> 01:13:14,260 There was a lot of singing in South Africa as well. 1147 01:13:18,140 --> 01:13:19,340 This too much? 1148 01:13:24,060 --> 01:13:26,420 Mama! Look! 1149 01:13:26,420 --> 01:13:28,740 It's time to get ready for bed. 1150 01:13:28,740 --> 01:13:31,100 But, look... Toys in the box. 1151 01:13:31,100 --> 01:13:34,660 GABRIEL: It was so good, the music. 1152 01:13:34,660 --> 01:13:36,820 JULIAN ASSANGE: Mm-hm. STELLA MORIS: Music? 1153 01:13:36,820 --> 01:13:39,220 It was good, that music. 1154 01:13:39,220 --> 01:13:40,860 Do you want to show Daddy 1155 01:13:40,860 --> 01:13:43,860 how you can sing Twinkle, Twinkle, Little Star? 1156 01:13:43,860 --> 01:13:47,060 GABRIEL: # Twinkle Twinkle, twinkle...# 1157 01:13:47,060 --> 01:13:48,980 SPEAKS INDISTINCTLY 1158 01:13:48,980 --> 01:13:50,860 Keep going. Keep going. 1159 01:13:50,860 --> 01:13:55,420 # Twinkle, twinkle Little star...# 1160 01:13:55,420 --> 01:13:59,100 GABRIEL BABBLES # How I wonder what you are 1161 01:13:59,100 --> 01:14:02,380 GABRIEL: # Twinkle Twinkle, twinkle...# 1162 01:14:03,420 --> 01:14:06,380 BELLS 1163 01:14:11,380 --> 01:14:13,060 Hi. 1164 01:14:13,060 --> 01:14:14,380 JULIAN ASSANGE: How are you? 1165 01:14:14,380 --> 01:14:16,780 All right. 1166 01:14:16,780 --> 01:14:18,780 So... Yes? 1167 01:14:18,780 --> 01:14:21,660 ..there's someone else using... 1168 01:14:21,660 --> 01:14:23,500 Purple Visits next to you? 1169 01:14:28,380 --> 01:14:29,820 Oh, OK. 1170 01:14:29,820 --> 01:14:31,100 Erm... 1171 01:14:32,620 --> 01:14:34,300 ..how are you? 1172 01:14:34,300 --> 01:14:36,420 Are you covering your neck beard? 1173 01:14:50,500 --> 01:14:53,060 A power nap? You see? 1174 01:14:53,060 --> 01:14:54,620 I can tell. 1175 01:14:58,460 --> 01:15:00,100 SHE LAUGHS 1176 01:15:02,260 --> 01:15:04,420 Well, I'm in the kids' room. 1177 01:15:04,420 --> 01:15:06,540 Well, where I sleep as well. 1178 01:15:08,260 --> 01:15:10,380 See? Yeah. 1179 01:15:11,580 --> 01:15:14,660 And it's a sunny day outside. Want to see? 1180 01:15:18,540 --> 01:15:20,020 It's the inner yard. 1181 01:15:21,740 --> 01:15:23,180 Yeah. 1182 01:15:23,180 --> 01:15:25,300 Do you want me to go out? 1183 01:15:30,140 --> 01:15:32,700 HOOVES CLOP 1184 01:15:32,700 --> 01:15:33,980 Yeah. 1185 01:15:35,060 --> 01:15:36,700 HORSE WHINNIES 1186 01:15:37,780 --> 01:15:39,460 Yeah. 1187 01:15:50,060 --> 01:15:52,420 BABBLES Come here. 1188 01:15:54,140 --> 01:15:59,340 I think many people who have had a family member with a... 1189 01:15:59,340 --> 01:16:02,180 you know, a depressive disorder or severe depression, 1190 01:16:02,180 --> 01:16:04,940 you just don't know how you can help. 1191 01:16:04,940 --> 01:16:08,460 And especially in this situation, where you're not even there, 1192 01:16:08,460 --> 01:16:11,540 you don't really know what's going on, 1193 01:16:11,540 --> 01:16:14,180 only what they tell you, erm... 1194 01:16:16,300 --> 01:16:19,900 It can be really, really tough. Er, so... 1195 01:16:26,060 --> 01:16:27,980 Yeah, I mean, it's... 1196 01:16:30,180 --> 01:16:32,460 Without the phone calls, it would be... 1197 01:16:34,500 --> 01:16:36,260 ..enormously... 1198 01:16:38,100 --> 01:16:40,860 ..challenging and difficult. Er... 1199 01:16:40,860 --> 01:16:43,820 With the phone calls, it's still challenging and difficult, 1200 01:16:43,820 --> 01:16:45,100 but it's... 1201 01:16:49,220 --> 01:16:52,980 ..it's really important, for both of us. 1202 01:16:52,980 --> 01:16:56,100 No, it's OK. I have to go. I have everything. 1203 01:16:56,100 --> 01:16:57,660 All the important stuff is in this... 1204 01:16:57,660 --> 01:17:00,980 BABBLES CHILDISHLY, YAWNS 1205 01:17:10,860 --> 01:17:12,460 You OK? Yeah. 1206 01:17:21,180 --> 01:17:23,860 SEVERINE BABBLES IN SING-SONG VOICE 1207 01:17:31,100 --> 01:17:32,580 So... 1208 01:17:32,580 --> 01:17:35,100 ..how long...when are... 1209 01:17:35,100 --> 01:17:38,420 How longer are you gonna be in... 1210 01:17:38,420 --> 01:17:40,740 in...in London? 1211 01:17:40,740 --> 01:17:42,740 It won't be long now. 1212 01:17:42,740 --> 01:17:46,300 Just another 60 story times. 1213 01:17:46,300 --> 01:17:48,020 LAUGHS 1214 01:17:48,020 --> 01:17:54,100 'If I could give, illustrate, something about us, 1215 01:17:54,100 --> 01:18:01,100 'in Moby-Dick, they would spot a whale pod from the mast, 1216 01:18:01,100 --> 01:18:02,660 'and they'd launch the boats.' 1217 01:18:02,660 --> 01:18:06,500 Now, if the whales are disciplined, 1218 01:18:06,500 --> 01:18:10,940 they can probably outrun the rowing boats 1219 01:18:10,940 --> 01:18:12,860 that are after them. 1220 01:18:12,860 --> 01:18:16,420 But the rowing boats keep on coming, 1221 01:18:16,420 --> 01:18:18,580 keep on coming, keep on coming, 1222 01:18:18,580 --> 01:18:21,220 keep on coming, keep on coming. 1223 01:18:21,220 --> 01:18:25,220 And this translates to a... 1224 01:18:25,220 --> 01:18:29,220 a fear...in the pod. 1225 01:18:29,220 --> 01:18:33,100 And the fear... 1226 01:18:33,100 --> 01:18:35,740 generates urgency, 1227 01:18:35,740 --> 01:18:38,820 and urgency generates panic, 1228 01:18:38,820 --> 01:18:40,780 and the panic... 1229 01:18:40,780 --> 01:18:43,740 causes them to break form. 1230 01:18:43,740 --> 01:18:45,380 Once they break in form, 1231 01:18:45,380 --> 01:18:47,540 they fall victim to the hunters. 1232 01:18:47,540 --> 01:18:48,900 MAN: Mmm. 1233 01:18:48,900 --> 01:18:52,460 You learn, through practice after practice after practice 1234 01:18:52,460 --> 01:18:53,860 to keep form. 1235 01:18:55,300 --> 01:18:57,820 As long as you keep to form... 1236 01:19:00,820 --> 01:19:03,820 MAN: For publishing hundreds of thousands of classified documents, 1237 01:19:03,820 --> 01:19:05,820 he faces a maximum jail sentence 1238 01:19:05,820 --> 01:19:09,380 of 175 years under the Espionage Act. 1239 01:19:09,380 --> 01:19:12,700 He's already spent 21 months in a UK prison. 1240 01:19:12,700 --> 01:19:15,420 On Monday, a judge at London's Old Bailey 1241 01:19:15,420 --> 01:19:19,660 will decide whether he can be extradited to the United States, 1242 01:19:19,660 --> 01:19:22,820 but both sides can appeal a decision that goes against them, 1243 01:19:22,820 --> 01:19:28,300 so either way, Julian Assange's legal struggles are set to continue. 1244 01:19:36,700 --> 01:19:39,580 More police this time, huh? 1245 01:19:41,340 --> 01:19:44,180 It's fascism! Get that into your heads! 1246 01:19:44,180 --> 01:19:45,460 I am giving you a warning. 1247 01:19:45,460 --> 01:19:48,140 Are you going to give my property back? 1248 01:19:48,140 --> 01:19:54,260 I have been a loud voice for Julian Assange! 1249 01:19:54,260 --> 01:19:59,140 We could have been there, but this... 1250 01:19:59,140 --> 01:20:03,140 is a really strong opportunity 1251 01:20:03,140 --> 01:20:05,460 to put Julian's case before... 1252 01:20:06,900 --> 01:20:09,100 ..people in the United States 1253 01:20:09,100 --> 01:20:11,980 that are responsible for these decisions. 1254 01:20:11,980 --> 01:20:16,380 SHOUTING Free Julian Assange! 1255 01:20:16,380 --> 01:20:19,380 Julian's just entered the courtroom. 1256 01:20:19,380 --> 01:20:20,940 Ah. 1257 01:20:20,940 --> 01:20:23,260 Is that Twitter? Yeah. 1258 01:20:26,140 --> 01:20:28,660 MAN: Free Julian Assange! 1259 01:20:31,580 --> 01:20:34,060 PROTESTERS: Free Julian Assange! 1260 01:20:34,060 --> 01:20:37,540 Free Julian Assange! 1261 01:20:41,540 --> 01:20:45,380 Judge enters. Judge giving her na...his name. 1262 01:20:45,380 --> 01:20:49,940 PROTESTERS: Free Julian Assange! Free Julian Assange! 1263 01:20:49,940 --> 01:20:51,820 Judge says that she found 1264 01:20:51,820 --> 01:20:53,820 that notwithstanding his support from family, 1265 01:20:53,820 --> 01:20:57,060 Mr Assange has remained either severely or moderately 1266 01:20:57,060 --> 01:20:59,340 clinically depressed during detention 1267 01:20:59,340 --> 01:21:02,700 and that he is at risk of suicide or self-harm. 1268 01:21:02,700 --> 01:21:04,660 He has the intelligence and determination 1269 01:21:04,660 --> 01:21:07,460 to circumvent suicide protocols. 1270 01:21:07,460 --> 01:21:09,780 No extradition. 1271 01:21:09,780 --> 01:21:12,100 No extradition? That's what Mary's saying. 1272 01:21:12,100 --> 01:21:15,500 CHEERING AND APPLAUSE 1273 01:21:19,540 --> 01:21:23,780 Yeah! Free Assange! 1274 01:21:23,780 --> 01:21:26,340 Free Assange! CHEERING 1275 01:21:26,340 --> 01:21:28,660 LAUGHS PROTESTERS: Free Julian Assange! 1276 01:21:28,660 --> 01:21:31,020 Free Julian Assange! 1277 01:21:31,020 --> 01:21:33,220 Yeah, good work, all those people. 1278 01:21:33,220 --> 01:21:37,500 PROTESTERS: Free! Free, free, free Assange! Free, free... 1279 01:21:37,500 --> 01:21:39,380 Developing news - this is coming out of the UK 1280 01:21:39,380 --> 01:21:40,660 just in the past few minutes. 1281 01:21:40,660 --> 01:21:43,740 A court has denied a request from the United States... 1282 01:21:43,740 --> 01:21:45,940 A very significant decision made 1283 01:21:45,940 --> 01:21:50,180 to refuse this extradition of Julian Assange. 1284 01:21:50,180 --> 01:21:52,020 Well, the judge ruled against extradition 1285 01:21:52,020 --> 01:21:55,620 because she said she was concerned about Assange's mental health. 1286 01:21:55,620 --> 01:21:57,140 MAN: She said, and to quote her words, 1287 01:21:57,140 --> 01:22:00,020 "I'm satisfied that the procedures described by the US 1288 01:22:00,020 --> 01:22:03,460 "will not prevent Mr Assange from finding a way to commit suicide." 1289 01:22:03,460 --> 01:22:07,260 PROTESTERS: Free Assange now! They're coming out now. 1290 01:22:07,260 --> 01:22:11,740 Keep to the side. Keep it to that side. 1291 01:22:11,740 --> 01:22:13,260 Let's have some room, guys. Come on. 1292 01:22:13,260 --> 01:22:14,940 Keep moving back, please. 1293 01:22:14,940 --> 01:22:18,460 Move back. Keep moving back. Keep moving back. 1294 01:22:19,780 --> 01:22:23,100 CHEERING AND APPLAUSE 1295 01:22:27,460 --> 01:22:28,940 STELLA MORIS: Please bear with me, 1296 01:22:28,940 --> 01:22:31,420 because I've had to rewrite my speech. 1297 01:22:31,420 --> 01:22:33,580 LAUGHS Oh, dear. Oh, dear. 1298 01:22:33,580 --> 01:22:35,580 I had hoped that today 1299 01:22:35,580 --> 01:22:38,700 would be the day that Julian would come home. 1300 01:22:40,020 --> 01:22:42,380 Today is not that day. 1301 01:22:42,380 --> 01:22:44,020 But that day will come soon. 1302 01:22:44,020 --> 01:22:45,620 WOMAN: Yeah. 1303 01:22:45,620 --> 01:22:48,180 We are extremely concerned 1304 01:22:48,180 --> 01:22:52,140 that the US government has decided to appeal this decision. 1305 01:22:53,220 --> 01:22:56,060 It continues to want to punish Julian. 1306 01:22:57,820 --> 01:23:01,260 We will never accept that journalism is a crime, 1307 01:23:01,260 --> 01:23:03,900 in this country or any other. 1308 01:23:05,380 --> 01:23:11,420 I ask you all to shout louder, lobby harder until he is free. 1309 01:23:11,420 --> 01:23:13,460 Free Julian. 1310 01:23:13,460 --> 01:23:15,260 Free the press. 1311 01:23:15,260 --> 01:23:17,420 Free us all. SHOUTING 1312 01:23:17,420 --> 01:23:19,340 CROWD: Free Julian Assange! 1313 01:23:19,340 --> 01:23:21,740 Free, free! Now! 1314 01:23:21,740 --> 01:23:39,220 Free Julian Assange! Now! 1315 01:23:39,220 --> 01:23:43,660 Free Julian Assange! Now! CHEERING 1316 01:23:43,660 --> 01:23:46,820 SHOUTING 1317 01:23:46,820 --> 01:23:49,340 CHANTING CONTINUES INDISTINCTLY 1318 01:23:53,580 --> 01:23:55,900 Oh, Dad, do you... How do you feel, not being there? 1319 01:23:55,900 --> 01:23:57,060 Huh? 1320 01:23:57,060 --> 01:23:58,500 How do you feel not being there? 1321 01:23:58,500 --> 01:24:01,580 Oh, OK. OK. I...I... 1322 01:24:01,580 --> 01:24:04,620 I like to...to, erm... 1323 01:24:04,620 --> 01:24:07,740 build the house and see other people move in. 1324 01:24:09,820 --> 01:24:11,540 It's my nature. 1325 01:24:11,540 --> 01:24:14,660 PROTESTERS: Free Assange now! Free Assange now! 1326 01:24:14,660 --> 01:24:17,860 FIDEL NARVAEZ: Every journalist should be concerned 1327 01:24:17,860 --> 01:24:22,300 about what was said today in court. 1328 01:24:22,300 --> 01:24:24,340 Because... 1329 01:24:24,340 --> 01:24:28,740 the political arguments provided by the United States 1330 01:24:28,740 --> 01:24:33,460 were upheld by the British judicial system. 1331 01:24:33,460 --> 01:24:39,540 I repeat, it's only the doctor's assessment 1332 01:24:39,540 --> 01:24:44,100 of the fragile health condition of Julian Assange 1333 01:24:44,100 --> 01:24:47,940 that have saved him from extradition. 1334 01:24:47,940 --> 01:24:50,740 So, what does this case mean for media freedoms, 1335 01:24:50,740 --> 01:24:53,940 and especially in light of today's judgement? 1336 01:24:53,940 --> 01:24:56,340 ANDREW FOWLER: Well, it looks as though 1337 01:24:56,340 --> 01:24:58,300 what journalists do for a living 1338 01:24:58,300 --> 01:25:02,220 is seen by the British courts to be a criminal act. 1339 01:25:02,220 --> 01:25:04,820 In a sense, the system has succeeded 1340 01:25:04,820 --> 01:25:06,820 in intimidating the world 1341 01:25:06,820 --> 01:25:08,740 and in passing the message that, 1342 01:25:08,740 --> 01:25:10,940 "This is what's going to happen to you 1343 01:25:10,940 --> 01:25:16,180 "if ever you have the idea of publishing our dirty secrets." 1344 01:25:16,180 --> 01:25:18,940 We're wrong to think 1345 01:25:18,940 --> 01:25:21,780 that it's about who wins the extradition case. 1346 01:25:23,900 --> 01:25:26,540 As long as Julian Assange is silenced, 1347 01:25:26,540 --> 01:25:28,980 in solitary confinement, 1348 01:25:28,980 --> 01:25:31,540 this proceeding can last as long as it wants. 1349 01:25:33,900 --> 01:25:36,500 The US has won. 1350 01:25:36,500 --> 01:25:39,900 I can guarantee you that already today, 1351 01:25:39,900 --> 01:25:44,620 people who might otherwise leak secret information 1352 01:25:44,620 --> 01:25:46,300 are now very careful about this, 1353 01:25:46,300 --> 01:25:48,900 because they can see with their own eyes what's going to happen. 1354 01:25:50,940 --> 01:25:53,260 And that's... THAT'S the dangerous thing. 1355 01:25:53,260 --> 01:25:56,780 We have to control our government. 1356 01:25:56,780 --> 01:25:58,980 That's what democracy is about. 1357 01:25:58,980 --> 01:26:01,660 How can you be controlling your government 1358 01:26:01,660 --> 01:26:04,020 if you don't know the truth? 1359 01:26:16,100 --> 01:26:17,780 VACUUM CLEANER WHIRRS 1360 01:26:21,900 --> 01:26:23,580 Can I show you around? 1361 01:26:24,580 --> 01:26:26,740 I guess as long as there's no... 1362 01:26:26,740 --> 01:26:28,580 no-one in the frame, right? 1363 01:26:32,820 --> 01:26:35,700 Your books. Oh, tent? 1364 01:26:39,180 --> 01:26:40,820 Yep. 1365 01:26:40,820 --> 01:26:42,180 Your books are here, 1366 01:26:42,180 --> 01:26:44,380 and your awards, a few of them. 1367 01:26:46,340 --> 01:26:48,620 And a Australia map. 1368 01:26:51,180 --> 01:26:52,820 MAN: Now, good morning to you, Stella, 1369 01:26:52,820 --> 01:26:55,020 and it is a very good morning for you. 1370 01:26:55,020 --> 01:26:57,460 You're his fiancee, but you're also his lawyer. 1371 01:26:57,460 --> 01:27:00,020 What was going through your mind when that verdict was given? 1372 01:27:00,020 --> 01:27:05,220 Erm, well, I...I had prepared myself for the worst, and... 1373 01:27:05,220 --> 01:27:07,180 but once I realised that Julian has...had won, 1374 01:27:07,180 --> 01:27:10,180 I...I wept with relief, 1375 01:27:10,180 --> 01:27:12,500 and it was a very emotional moment. 1376 01:27:12,500 --> 01:27:16,860 Erm, so I'm...I'm hopeful that what follows from that 1377 01:27:16,860 --> 01:27:19,340 is that he'll be released today from Belmarsh, 1378 01:27:19,340 --> 01:27:23,020 because the conditions in Belmarsh are absolutely atrocious. 1379 01:27:33,420 --> 01:27:35,700 INDISTINCT CLAMOURING 1380 01:27:37,580 --> 01:27:40,500 This is a huge disappointment. 1381 01:27:40,500 --> 01:27:42,300 Julian should not be in Belmarsh Prison 1382 01:27:42,300 --> 01:27:44,500 in the first place. 1383 01:27:44,500 --> 01:27:48,500 I urge the Department of Justice to drop the charges 1384 01:27:48,500 --> 01:27:50,980 and the President of the United States 1385 01:27:50,980 --> 01:27:52,780 to pardon Julian. 1386 01:28:07,100 --> 01:28:08,300 OK. 1387 01:28:09,740 --> 01:28:10,940 OK. 1388 01:28:12,340 --> 01:28:14,220 I'm just so tired. 1389 01:28:20,740 --> 01:28:22,500 Yeah. 1390 01:28:24,180 --> 01:28:25,260 Oh, God. 1391 01:28:25,260 --> 01:28:28,380 Trump supporters have stormed the US Capitol Building. 1392 01:28:29,460 --> 01:28:31,660 MAN: The peaceful transfer of power, 1393 01:28:31,660 --> 01:28:33,940 the cornerstone of American democracy, 1394 01:28:33,940 --> 01:28:36,340 seemed a highly abstract concept today... 1395 01:28:36,340 --> 01:28:37,860 SHOUTING 1396 01:28:37,860 --> 01:28:40,660 ..as Trump supporters clashed with police 1397 01:28:40,660 --> 01:28:44,020 as they tried, and succeeded, to storm the Congress, 1398 01:28:44,020 --> 01:28:46,020 where America's elected leaders 1399 01:28:46,020 --> 01:28:50,300 had gathered to certify the election victory of Joe Biden. 1400 01:28:50,300 --> 01:28:52,660 Leading Republicans have distanced themselves 1401 01:28:52,660 --> 01:28:55,580 from the President, who has not condemned the rioters, 1402 01:28:55,580 --> 01:28:57,380 and now there are growing calls 1403 01:28:57,380 --> 01:28:59,900 for President Trump to be removed from office, 1404 01:28:59,900 --> 01:29:03,300 with just 13 days to go before the end of his term. 1405 01:29:03,300 --> 01:29:05,500 Donald Trump will reportedly issue 1406 01:29:05,500 --> 01:29:07,980 around 100 pardons and commutations 1407 01:29:07,980 --> 01:29:09,980 on his final days in office. 1408 01:29:09,980 --> 01:29:12,300 Free press advocates are calling on the President 1409 01:29:12,300 --> 01:29:16,820 to pardon WikiLeaks founder and Australian citizen Julian Assange. 1410 01:29:37,740 --> 01:29:38,980 OK. 1411 01:29:40,740 --> 01:29:42,260 Yep. 1412 01:29:42,260 --> 01:29:44,420 STELLA: 'Hi.' JOHN: Hi. 1413 01:29:44,420 --> 01:29:46,860 'Erm, Trump might get... 1414 01:29:48,340 --> 01:29:51,700 '..er, removed before the 20th.' 1415 01:29:51,700 --> 01:29:55,420 Yeah, I think on balance, it's a good idea to... 1416 01:29:55,420 --> 01:30:00,380 to hire this, or appoint this, lobbyist. 1417 01:30:02,180 --> 01:30:05,700 Oh. Well, er, erm, if you say so. 1418 01:30:05,700 --> 01:30:10,100 But I don't know. I can't see what's in it for Mr Trump. 1419 01:30:10,100 --> 01:30:15,180 People say that it'd be great to get up Hillary's nose on the way out. 1420 01:30:15,180 --> 01:30:17,460 Well, that's not much of a motivation 1421 01:30:17,460 --> 01:30:19,860 for a president, 1422 01:30:19,860 --> 01:30:22,060 you know, to...to, er... 1423 01:30:22,060 --> 01:30:23,780 No, it's not about that. 1424 01:30:23,780 --> 01:30:26,460 It's about his base wanting the pardon. 1425 01:30:26,460 --> 01:30:27,660 'Well...' 1426 01:30:27,660 --> 01:30:30,900 The base that he needs to be able to go for... 1427 01:30:30,900 --> 01:30:33,740 run for president in four years' time. 1428 01:30:33,740 --> 01:30:37,540 Well, that's not an argument for him doing it. 1429 01:30:37,540 --> 01:30:40,140 That's a description of the situation. 1430 01:30:40,140 --> 01:30:41,460 Yes. I hadn't finished. 1431 01:30:41,460 --> 01:30:43,260 I hadn't finished. Oh, sorry. 1432 01:30:43,260 --> 01:30:45,660 Yes? Erm... 1433 01:30:45,660 --> 01:30:47,980 He says he can put something in front of Trump, 1434 01:30:47,980 --> 01:30:50,500 you know, within 24 hours, so if that's true... 1435 01:30:50,500 --> 01:30:52,780 What's he going to... I mean, what's he going to say? 1436 01:30:52,780 --> 01:30:56,260 And I'm not sure we have anyone who CAN do that. 1437 01:30:56,260 --> 01:30:58,420 You don't need to look desperate. 1438 01:30:58,420 --> 01:31:00,060 It's not desperate. 1439 01:31:00,060 --> 01:31:03,300 Everyone does it. Everyone does it. 1440 01:31:03,300 --> 01:31:05,460 Anyway, er... 1441 01:31:05,460 --> 01:31:08,180 It...it doesn't smell good. 1442 01:31:41,820 --> 01:31:43,060 Hi, Julian. 1443 01:31:43,060 --> 01:31:44,300 Yep. 1444 01:31:44,300 --> 01:31:47,780 Erm, he's a little bit spooked, because they've threatened him. 1445 01:31:47,780 --> 01:31:49,780 They're threatening his family. 1446 01:31:49,780 --> 01:31:51,420 Erm... 1447 01:31:51,420 --> 01:31:55,820 He says he's been called a traitor, that he should leave America, 1448 01:31:55,820 --> 01:31:58,420 he's betraying his country... 1449 01:31:58,420 --> 01:31:59,700 Erm... 1450 01:32:01,580 --> 01:32:05,180 That the National Security apparatus 1451 01:32:05,180 --> 01:32:07,220 is pushing back very strongly. 1452 01:32:07,220 --> 01:32:11,940 And while he was optimistic 24 hours ago or so, 1453 01:32:11,940 --> 01:32:15,620 there are very powerful forces that want to... 1454 01:32:15,620 --> 01:32:17,820 stop it from happening. 1455 01:32:17,820 --> 01:32:21,220 And then I said, "Well, my view is that 1456 01:32:21,220 --> 01:32:23,020 "the legal case is just a pretext. 1457 01:32:23,020 --> 01:32:25,500 "They're just finding any way they can 1458 01:32:25,500 --> 01:32:28,780 "to keep Julian in prison for the longest amount of time." 1459 01:32:28,780 --> 01:32:32,580 And he said, "I would go further than that, 1460 01:32:32,580 --> 01:32:36,220 "and I'm afraid to say that... that people want him dead." 1461 01:32:45,100 --> 01:32:46,820 MAN: Mr President! 1462 01:32:46,820 --> 01:32:50,140 You lose this election fair and square! 1463 01:33:01,340 --> 01:33:03,180 So, how are things there? 1464 01:33:26,940 --> 01:33:28,420 Mm. 1465 01:33:48,820 --> 01:33:50,060 Mm. 1466 01:33:51,420 --> 01:33:52,700 JULIAN ASSANGE: Yeah. 1467 01:34:10,220 --> 01:34:11,700 SIGHS 1468 01:34:20,660 --> 01:34:24,300 JOE BIDEN: My distinguished guests, my fellow Americans, 1469 01:34:24,300 --> 01:34:28,180 this is America's day. 1470 01:34:28,180 --> 01:34:31,020 This is democracy's day. 1471 01:34:31,020 --> 01:34:35,420 A day of history and hope, of renewal and resolve. 1472 01:34:35,420 --> 01:34:38,420 What are the common objects we as Americans love, 1473 01:34:38,420 --> 01:34:41,020 that define us as Americans? 1474 01:34:41,020 --> 01:34:42,620 I think we know. 1475 01:34:42,620 --> 01:34:45,980 Opportunity. Security. 1476 01:34:45,980 --> 01:34:49,860 Liberty. Dignity, respect, honour. 1477 01:34:49,860 --> 01:34:52,420 And, yes, the truth. 1478 01:34:52,420 --> 01:34:54,660 APPLAUSE 1479 01:34:54,660 --> 01:34:56,420 Recent weeks and months 1480 01:34:56,420 --> 01:34:58,900 have taught us a painful lesson. 1481 01:34:58,900 --> 01:35:02,220 There is truth and there are lies. 1482 01:35:02,220 --> 01:35:06,460 Lies told for power and for profit. 1483 01:35:06,460 --> 01:35:09,700 And each of us has a duty AND a responsibility, 1484 01:35:09,700 --> 01:35:14,380 as citizens, as Americans, and especially as leaders, 1485 01:35:14,380 --> 01:35:17,740 to defend the truth and defeat the lies. 1486 01:35:38,700 --> 01:35:42,100 Truth is, er, very vexatious, yeah. 1487 01:35:42,100 --> 01:35:43,700 I mean... 1488 01:35:43,700 --> 01:35:46,700 You know, you see people writing all the time 1489 01:35:46,700 --> 01:35:48,420 "The truth will set you free." 1490 01:35:48,420 --> 01:35:50,180 Well, that's probably correct. 1491 01:35:51,580 --> 01:35:54,940 But the truth may be 1492 01:35:54,940 --> 01:35:57,460 that human beings are collective animals 1493 01:35:57,460 --> 01:36:00,980 and always will act in a collective group to a... 1494 01:36:00,980 --> 01:36:05,020 And that collective group will be guarded and guided 1495 01:36:05,020 --> 01:36:10,100 by an ideology, so your uttering an actuality 1496 01:36:10,100 --> 01:36:16,700 and your favoured insight into things as a truth is... 1497 01:36:16,700 --> 01:36:19,460 can be awfully misleading, you know? 1498 01:36:21,340 --> 01:36:23,860 I suppose that's our only thing, you know, 1499 01:36:23,860 --> 01:36:28,540 I really would like to reveal to you. 1500 01:36:28,540 --> 01:36:32,180 I don't mind the truth, yeah. 1501 01:36:32,180 --> 01:36:34,020 The truth is, it can on... 1502 01:36:34,020 --> 01:36:37,700 things can only get worse for Julian. 1503 01:36:37,700 --> 01:36:39,780 It cannot get better. 1504 01:36:39,780 --> 01:36:43,700 That time has gone. It's all gone away. 1505 01:36:43,700 --> 01:36:46,180 He's 49. 1506 01:36:46,180 --> 01:36:48,580 It's all gone. 1507 01:36:48,580 --> 01:36:50,380 And the same for me. 1508 01:36:50,380 --> 01:36:52,340 It's all...it's used up, 1509 01:36:52,340 --> 01:36:54,380 cos, well, me more so than him, 1510 01:36:54,380 --> 01:36:57,740 but his situation is parlous, parlous, 1511 01:36:57,740 --> 01:37:01,020 because it might take his sanity as well. 1512 01:37:03,940 --> 01:37:05,820 That's the destiny. 1513 01:37:05,820 --> 01:37:07,980 And that's the hard bit that 1514 01:37:07,980 --> 01:37:10,140 you guys won't face in your filming, 1515 01:37:10,140 --> 01:37:12,700 because it's not popular. 1516 01:37:12,700 --> 01:37:14,060 Yeah. 1517 01:37:14,060 --> 01:37:16,860 MAN: You must believe things are going to get better. 1518 01:37:16,860 --> 01:37:19,500 I know they can't. 1519 01:37:19,500 --> 01:37:22,060 I'm 76. What the fuck? 1520 01:37:22,060 --> 01:37:23,660 I've got a five-year-old daughter. 1521 01:37:23,660 --> 01:37:24,820 Mmm. 1522 01:37:24,820 --> 01:37:28,100 I'm here, and she's there. How can that get better? 1523 01:37:29,340 --> 01:37:31,500 Is there any... 1524 01:37:31,500 --> 01:37:34,980 way that I can reclaim the year, 1525 01:37:34,980 --> 01:37:37,140 and go and spend it with my daughter, 1526 01:37:37,140 --> 01:37:39,900 who'll never have that year again? 1527 01:37:39,900 --> 01:37:42,780 So it can only get worse. 1528 01:37:42,780 --> 01:37:44,180 I don't know. 1529 01:37:44,180 --> 01:37:46,340 I don't think you'd be doing it unless you thought 1530 01:37:46,340 --> 01:37:48,180 it WOULD get better, in some way. 1531 01:37:49,820 --> 01:37:51,380 Mm. 1532 01:37:51,380 --> 01:37:53,100 The strongest... 1533 01:37:54,180 --> 01:37:57,220 ..justification of life is to say, 1534 01:37:57,220 --> 01:38:00,260 "Look, I'd do it all again, the same." 1535 01:38:00,260 --> 01:38:01,860 Yeah. OK. 1536 01:38:01,860 --> 01:38:04,020 Well, that's where I am. 1537 01:38:04,020 --> 01:38:07,780 Look! Mama! Big squirrel! 1538 01:38:07,780 --> 01:38:09,500 STELLA MORIS: Come here! 1539 01:38:09,500 --> 01:38:12,500 Sweetheart. Squirrel. 1540 01:38:12,500 --> 01:38:15,300 Squirrel! He's coming down. PHONE RINGS 1541 01:38:15,300 --> 01:38:16,540 LAUGHS 1542 01:38:19,780 --> 01:38:21,460 Mama? STELLA MORIS: Yep. 1543 01:38:21,460 --> 01:38:24,020 Erm, how are you doing? 1544 01:38:24,020 --> 01:38:26,260 JOHN SHIPTON: Yeah, OK. OK. 1545 01:38:26,260 --> 01:38:28,860 Er, tomorrow, erm... 1546 01:38:28,860 --> 01:38:31,300 PHONE RINGS 1547 01:38:31,300 --> 01:38:32,900 Oh, goodness. 1548 01:38:32,900 --> 01:38:34,580 Sorry. Sorry. Sorry, John. 1549 01:38:34,580 --> 01:38:37,340 Let me...let me call you back. It's Julian. 1550 01:38:37,340 --> 01:38:38,820 Sorry. Sorry. 1551 01:38:38,820 --> 01:38:40,140 Bye. Hi. 1552 01:38:43,580 --> 01:38:44,900 OK. 1553 01:38:44,900 --> 01:38:46,500 Mmm... 1554 01:38:49,340 --> 01:38:51,900 "What Julian stands for goes to the very heart 1555 01:38:51,900 --> 01:38:54,540 "of what it means to live in a democracy." 1556 01:38:58,260 --> 01:39:02,140 I'd like to thank everyone for being here, 1557 01:39:02,140 --> 01:39:07,780 in the city that embodies the values that Julian defended. 1558 01:39:07,780 --> 01:39:11,260 Erm...it's...it's the first time 1559 01:39:11,260 --> 01:39:15,140 that I see the statue in person, 1560 01:39:15,140 --> 01:39:17,500 and it's also the first time 1561 01:39:17,500 --> 01:39:20,300 I see Julian's likeness... 1562 01:39:22,340 --> 01:39:24,300 EMOTIONALLY ..in three dimensions... 1563 01:39:25,980 --> 01:39:27,780 ..since 6 January. 1564 01:39:29,260 --> 01:39:31,700 We're in a situation now where 1565 01:39:31,700 --> 01:39:35,260 the only two outcomes that will happen 1566 01:39:35,260 --> 01:39:38,500 is either Julian regains his freedom 1567 01:39:38,500 --> 01:39:40,660 or he loses his life. 1568 01:39:40,660 --> 01:39:42,860 I am here to remind you 1569 01:39:42,860 --> 01:39:45,740 that Julian isn't a name, he's not a symbol. 1570 01:39:45,740 --> 01:39:49,460 He's a man, he's a human being, and he's suffering. 1571 01:39:50,940 --> 01:39:53,500 He has children. He has a family. 1572 01:39:53,500 --> 01:39:55,500 SNIFFS 1573 01:39:55,500 --> 01:39:58,900 They're hiding him from view. They're silencing him. 1574 01:39:58,900 --> 01:40:02,340 It is an aberration that Julian is not a free man. 1575 01:40:04,060 --> 01:40:07,100 In no sane world can this be normalised. 1576 01:40:07,100 --> 01:40:09,860 CHEERING AND APPLAUSE 1577 01:40:11,900 --> 01:40:14,260 HOOVES CLOP 1578 01:40:19,380 --> 01:40:22,380 INDISTINCT CHATTER 1579 01:40:30,940 --> 01:40:33,140 CHILD WHINES 1580 01:40:43,260 --> 01:40:45,780 What keeps you calm 1581 01:40:45,780 --> 01:40:50,220 is a particular sort of energy, 1582 01:40:50,220 --> 01:40:52,540 an energy that comes from... 1583 01:40:53,900 --> 01:40:58,500 ..return on energy that you invest... 1584 01:40:59,780 --> 01:41:01,060 ..in... 1585 01:41:03,620 --> 01:41:05,780 ..in what you're doing. 1586 01:41:07,100 --> 01:41:12,060 You find yourself not procrastinating... 1587 01:41:13,500 --> 01:41:15,380 ..and... 1588 01:41:17,060 --> 01:41:19,300 ..just taking... 1589 01:41:20,540 --> 01:41:24,460 ..what comes towards you in the stream of life 1590 01:41:24,460 --> 01:41:28,580 without opinion and prejudice. 1591 01:41:28,580 --> 01:41:32,500 And just doing what you can with that, 1592 01:41:32,500 --> 01:41:34,620 that comes towards you. 1593 01:41:38,060 --> 01:41:40,980 Not being frightened... 1594 01:41:40,980 --> 01:41:42,860 is a great help. 1595 01:41:42,860 --> 01:41:44,180 HOOVES CLOP 1596 01:41:48,180 --> 01:41:50,780 Oh. Here's another horse. 1597 01:41:50,780 --> 01:41:53,500 HOOVES CLOP 1598 01:41:53,500 --> 01:41:55,500 A lovely sound, that. 1599 01:41:55,500 --> 01:41:57,940 CLOPPING CONTINUES 1600 01:42:09,580 --> 01:42:12,220 CLOPPING FADES, CHUCKLES